Episode III.VII – The Castle of Fyrien
Join us for The Castle of Fyrien, in epsiode 7 of Season 3 of BBC Merlin
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26th October 2020 @ 7:53 am
Also, Morgana makes me mad because even if she felt betrayed, she seems to forget that she betrayed them first. She felt afraid and alone but she made a choice. And her choice forced Merlin to make one. I think this shows that even if she cares about others, ultimately the person she cares about is herself. She doesn’t care if she was wrong, just that she was wronged.
26th October 2020 @ 2:26 pm
she betrayed them first but also, even before she betrayed them, she made horribly selfish reckless decisions that put dozens of people in danger… that’s also never brought up and thrown in her face. I do wish they’d found a way to legitimitaly write her arc and turn her evil because so much of our issues with the show would just disappear if they had… =/
M Xx
26th October 2020 @ 7:36 am
Another thought. That scene where she’s trying to be okay in front of Merlin is beautiful, Angel Coulby is just beautiful over all in this episode.
26th October 2020 @ 7:34 am
I’m probably too late sorry but I wanted to share my thoughts.
LESSONS
Elyan learns how to be a better brother to be there for Gwen.
Gwen learns to forgive Elyan, rely on Merlin, and again that Arthur means it when he says he’ll be there for her.
That’s all I could think of I’m tired😅.
Overall I like the episode alright, it isn’t the strongest in my mind but I did enjoy rewatching it. Mostly I like the humor in the episode (excluding the “all mouth no trousers” joke). I like the waking scene, the chloroform bit, and oblivious Merlin at the campfire. The moment where Merlin pushes Arthur out to face the guard almost felt like a call back to when Arthur did the same in the Wildereon episode.
I like the family relationships in this episode. It makes me sad that Morgana is a traitor since Merlin is a little right in that, Arthur and Gwen never meant to hurt Morgana and don’t deserve her betrayal.
I don’t know why but I love that moment where Cenred does the little bow to Morgause when he’s captured them. It’s over the top and delightful.
I also noticed how Elyan’s introduction felt a bit stereotypical in that he means well but always manages to get into trouble. It’s an endearing character trait but it doesn’t sit very well, especially since um… Gwen is portrayed to be the “good child” and she’s a bit lighter skinned. But I don’t think it was intentional and I may just be reading into things, ( if I am, I’m sorry🤦🏻♀️). But other than that I quite like Elyan. He’s a good brother and I enjoy his relationship with Gwen. I think seeing this sister side to her gives her a bit more dimension.
Also I love the Arthur competency, I wish he had that more often and that Merlin had a bit more in this episode. Unfortunately they share a single brain cell.
Part of me wishes Merlin would also try harder to win Morgana over instead of giving up completely and being snide. I understand but it’s hard to watch.
And the no nonsense Arthur bit where he just picks up Morgana is also delightful.
It was a fun episode and I can’t wait for next week! (If I misspoke at all please forgive me)
26th October 2020 @ 4:16 pm
— The moment where Merlin pushes Arthur out to face the guard almost felt like a call back to when Arthur did the same in the Wildereon episode.–
it absolutely does, and I kind of love that, but I said this in another comment as well…. i wish the show let merlin be good and clever, and yeah, totally do what arthur did, but then actually have a follow up plan, in which you knock out the bad guy. or at least try. you can still have arthur actually finish him off and deliver the winning blow, that’s cool.
–I don’t know why but I love that moment where Cenred does the little bow to Morgause when he’s captured them. It’s over the top and delightful.–
over the top and delightful is I believe what Tom Ellis’ business card says 😀 😀 he’s fantastic!
I think it is safe to say that the merlin creators didn’t mean to be offensive. It’s just thoughtless and falling into cliches, and by doing so they of course further the thoughtless use of those tropes and cliches.
I work really hard at being more aware of these issues, and I am very concious that my privilige means there are going to be dozens of instances that I miss, or where I perpetuate such stereotypes myself because I say something without thinking or without considering someone else’s perspective on it. All we can do is work on ourselves, ask more questions, try harder, and listen to other people and their experiences and not dismiss people when they say ‘no, this wasn’t okay, and here is why’, even if we initially don’t understand it, or don’t see an issue with it ourselves.
–Part of me wishes Merlin would also try harder to win Morgana over instead of giving up completely and being snide. I understand but it’s hard to watch.–
or at least show us when Merlin gave up trying, and make that a proper breaking moment. like for example when morgana tried to have him killed… that should be enough to make merlin realise she’s t0o far gone and there’s nothing he can do to help her. but it doesn’t feel like the show plays it that way, especially as morgana forgets that she wanted to kill merlin every 5 minutes lol
M Xx
26th October 2020 @ 6:57 pm
or at least show us when Merlin gave up trying, and make that a proper breaking moment –
I thought that was the talk with the dragon after he’d rescued Merlin from the serkets. You know, the ‘hate to your love, darkness to your light’ speech. However, especially since Merlin knows that the dragon is manipulative and murderous, I would like to see him try to get her back, to fight for her. And not just swallow what the great lizard tells him – especially since he has rarely done so before. He wouldn’t kill the druid boy and he helped Morgana find out her powers, all against the dragon’s advice. But no, now he believes him wholeheartedly and that’s the end of that.
26th October 2020 @ 7:19 pm
I guess so. but yeah, as you say, it’s not like Merlin hasn’t nodded along to everything the dragon has said, only to turn around and completely ignore it afterwards so… because we don’t actually get a response and any agreement from Merlin on it, it certainly hasn’t registered as THE MOMENT in my head…
M Xx
26th October 2020 @ 7:26 pm
Thanks for replying and all you two’s hard work!
26th October 2020 @ 9:34 pm
Xx
26th October 2020 @ 1:15 am
One thing of your review struck me. Elyan’s hood (chaperon) is one of the more accurate costume pieces in the show and I was thrilled when he showed up wearing it. Will also wore something similar in Moment of Truth and it’s peasant garb so it would be totally appropriate for Elyan or anyone of his status to wear. As you brought up the potential for a Robin Hood vibe with Elyan’s outfit, I don’t really think so. They both wore similar peasant clothing from the medieval time period and that’s about it. https://historyofeuropeanfashion.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/medieval3.jpg?w=457&h=240&zoom=2
This one is from 1180AD
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a9/12th-century_painters_-_Feeeding_the_Pigs_with_Acorns_-_WGA15845.jpg
Don’t even get me started on the rest of the costumes (rolls eyes). OMG. Accuracy was not what they were aiming for in this show so any time they were even close, I was so happy.
As for the episode, it’s not one of my favorites. I did like some of the smaller scenes like Merlin talking to Gwen about her injuries and Merlin and Arthur in the cell but mostly it didn’t make sense. Morgause would have totally tried to kill Merlin. I did like Tom Ellis in this. I started watching Miranda after he showed up here and now Lucifer. He’s quite a versatile actor and I really enjoy him chewing up the scenery.
26th October 2020 @ 2:24 pm
Thanks for doing (and sharing!!) the research on that! loving the pig acorn feeding imagery especially! that’s one stylish hood 😀
You’re the second person to bring up Miranda, I feel like I should watch it now, just to see what all the Tom Ellis is all about, because I do enjoy him A LOT!
M Xx
26th October 2020 @ 7:00 pm
You MUST watch Miranda. It’s so funny! And if you know Tom Ellis only as Cenred or Lucifer, you’re in for a surprise.
26th October 2020 @ 7:20 pm
is it on any convenient streaming service? (I’m sorry, I am insanely lazy and incapable of pirating anything… lol)
26th October 2020 @ 8:30 pm
It’s on iPlayer. 🙂
26th October 2020 @ 9:33 pm
hah! that is exactly the straight forward easy access I was looking for, yay!
9th November 2020 @ 8:02 pm
Definitely watch Miranda if you can. Ellis as straight man to Miranda’s wackiness is wonderful to watch.
10th November 2020 @ 12:09 pm
it’s on the list 😀
25th October 2020 @ 11:58 pm
This episode isn’t my favourite it’s still good and I like certain parts of it but as an overall episode it’s not the best in my opinion but there are parts that I really love the number one part that I really love is obviously a Merthur part. It’s the part where Merlin goes to wake up Arthur and tries to come up with an alternative wake-up call to say to Arthur I just love how he’s actually thinking of them and that little voice waiver he does is perfection I love it its so adorable
( I don’t really have any real lessons this week I couldn’t really think of any my brain was just not working this week 😂)
LESSONS
I think we learn that if you’re ever going to wake up Arthur and he even looks a little bit annoyed just run, run fast because you’re going to get something thrown at your head and that is something I imagine Merlin has learnt many times but I don’t think he cares because I think he low-key loves provoking Arthur a little bit.
( I tried with just a funny little half lesson this week because that’s all my brain could muster)
Cutting it a bit fine with the time here 😅
26th October 2020 @ 4:17 pm
oh, the littel waiver when he hears that sentence coming out of his mouth and realises what it actually sounds like!!! I love it so much!!!!
M Xx
25th October 2020 @ 10:08 pm
I’m sorry if anything is repeating what other people have said: I haven’t quite got around to reading everyone’s thoughts yet. I will though.
Comments:
I have a favourite bit of the podcast which is when you both simultaneously start quoting that awful Morgana line from 1.1. It IS the worst line. And sadly so memorable because of it.
The episode itself left me with a few questions:
Why doesn’t Elyan share his horse with Gwen, who is his sister, instead of Merlin, who is a complete stranger? It’s a tiny thing but it always bugs me because there is no sense in it.
Why does Arthur send Merlin and Morgana ahead of him after Merlin blew up the throne room? Is he planning to murder Morgause or Cenred? But we know he doesn’t so…why?
In the scene afterwards, when Arthur hoists Morgana on his shoulders, everyone is so delightfully shouty. I want more of these characters bellowing at each other. Maybe a frustration or two would be released and everyone could be happier for it.
I like that instead of the usual ‘Gaius and Merlin talk things through over dinner’ ending, we once again finish on Arthur and Gwen (same as last episode). I like that and it’s a nice set-up for 3.10. (So excited for THAT episode!)
I really love Merlin and Arthur in this episode. Their ongoing banter and non-verbal exchanges crack me up all the time and are so familiar and comfortable that they provide the perfect glue to this episode which is basically about exploring a great variety of relationships, many of them new/ changed ones. Also, I love that Arthur doesn’t dismiss Merlin when he says that he’ll have Arthur’s back when they ride out from Camelot. All Arthur says is that Morgana is better with a sword but he never once dismisses Merlin’s help. In fact, in the later scene in the dungeons, he relies on Merlin to help him come up with and execute a plan. Otherwise, why would he start telling Merlin about the non-existent escape plan if not to enlist his help? And, well, you talked at length how they so fully rely on each other in their double act when effecting their entire escape and rescue. I like it! 😊
On a related note, Merlin and his sword are hilarious in this episode: I like that he is finally given one but when they are attacked in the tunnels, he defends himself with the burning torch he holds in his other hand. Not once do I see him strike with the sword then. Of course, he later takes out the guard in the cell and gets Arthur’s acknowledgement, but I do get why he doesn’t bend down to pick up the sword of the second guard when they run out. Merlin’s just so delightfully ‘un-swordy’!
I think you called this episode a quest episode without a lot of questing. I think that is because, at its heart, it’s an episode about relationships. There are so many one-on-one conversations, showing any number of pairings, contrasting them, comparing them. The blockings of these scenes in particular are so noteworthy because they really showcase the relationships and subtle shifts in the dynamics as people move around the space. (I’m thinking of Elyan and Gwen’s scene in the dungeon when he comes to sit next to her.) Also, this is supported in the script. The repetitions of ‘brother’ and ‘sister’ by Gwen and Morgause jump out and I want to say that they are almost set in contrast. Gwen will do everything for Elyan, be there for him even though he wasn’t for her. But Morgause’s ‘sister’ sounds really demanding and possessive. She gives the commands and Morgana is constantly reminded of her task or to play her part well. Also, and I looked this up, the words ‘friend’ or ‘friendship’ are used more times (7x) than in most other Merlin episodes so far (the only one topping this is ‘The Moment of Truth’ (8x), interestingly) and by characters on both sides: Cenred calls Gwen, Merlin and Morgana Arthur’s friends and then again friends of Camelot. And of course, Merlin and Morgana have a long exchange about friends as well.
Lessons:
(I think) I have learned that Arthur may have a bit of a smell fetish: he is initially reluctant to smell the cloth Merlin brings him from Gwen’s house because he doesn’t think it’s important. But when he does sniff it, he really goes for it! In my head, that means Arthur is turned on by Gwen’s scent – or at least finds it very attractive.
Viewers learn that Gwen can be quite sassy, at least with her brother. She takes a bit of persuading to believe that he isn’t to blame for landing them in Cenred’s castle and bodily withdraws from him, giving him a disbelieving squint when they are left alone in the throne room. Later, she is even sassy to Cenred when she replies to his demands: “And what if I do not?” Finally, we learn that Gwen cheekily stole the two silk dresses she gives to Arthur from some noblewoman (presumably), mentioning that they won’t be missed for a day or two. I don’t think this is a departure from her selfless and kind self but it’s a really awesome extension. She may be kind, but she will not be trampled on. Could the reappearance of Elyan also have to do with the teasing out this more feisty Gwen, harking back to their early childhood relationship?
We also learn that Elyan is able to transform Gwen within seconds into the bumbling first-season self when her words constantly ran away with her and she kept saying/ implying more than she had meant to reveal. Here, she gives away her feelings for Arthur and his for her. Once again, this is a lovely insight into Gwen and Elyan’s sibling dynamic. It also makes me wonder whether Gwen’s first-season relationship with Merlin was only partly romantic fancy. Perhaps, with her brother only recently gone, she recognised something of Elyan in Merlin (carefree, unaware of etiquette and expectations) and related to him like his sister. Hence all the conversations where Gwen said more than she wanted to. Only Merlin wasn’t Elyan, so he had no clue that she was flirting. Elyan would have been able to read his sister in seconds.
I think Gwen and Arthur learn (about each other) that they each in some way admire, perhaps even wish they could have, a lifestyle like Elyan’s: never settled down, never thinking about the future, simply following his heart. Arthur says that it doesn’t seem too bad and even Gwen doesn’t object, only says that Elyan just manages to always be in the wrong place at the wrong time. And then they both learn that while they may like this lifestyle in their fancy, it is something neither of them would practically choose as it is also unpredictable and has basically kept Elyan from being there for Gwen whenever it mattered most. I think Gwen knows her brother loves her, but the fact that both she and Arthur repeat the line about being there for the person they love shows that when it comes to choices, both Arthur and her would choose a lifestyle with more pressures, ties and expectations if it meant they could be available for the people they care for.
I have learned that when I am feeling down or upset, I definitely need a Merlin around me: I just love that Merlin isn’t freaked out by Gwen’s tears, that he listens and offers wise words, he offers a comforting touch but nothing possessive or inappropriate. Also, Merlin clearly had already discovered the wonders of tea as a remedy in such situation. Actually, Merlin has already discovered, imported and brewed tea itself in these ye olde medieval times! How very progressive and ahead of his time. Everyone needs a Merlin in their lives!
Finally, we learn that Merlin would be amazing if he joined one of the Destiny and Chicken podcasts: He wonders in the dungeon why they haven’t been killed yet (when it would make complete sense that at least he should have been murdered). Shortly afterwards, he comes up with a rather far-fetched head cannon (You go into some sort of trance?) in a desperate attempt to make sense of odd character lines/ actions. I’m rather surprised that he didn’t comment, “That was a bit of a stupid line, wasn’t it?” after Arthur big-mouth-no-trousers ‘burn’.
25th October 2020 @ 11:33 pm
“The repetitions of ‘brother’ and ‘sister’ by Gwen and Morgause jump out and I want to say that they are almost set in contrast. Gwen will do everything for Elyan, be there for him even though he wasn’t for her. But Morgause’s ‘sister’ sounds really demanding and possessive.”
Hah I haven’t notice that, after all, this episode is not only about a group of friends (or former friends), but also about two pairs of siblings! That’s pretty neat 🙂 And yes, Gwen’s concern for Elyan is definitely contrasted with Morgause’s possessiveness of Morgana!
“Actually, Merlin has already discovered, imported and brewed tea itself in these ye olde medieval times! How very progressive and ahead of his time. Everyone needs a Merlin in their lives!”
Haha Merlin must have magicked tea into medieval England (with the tomatoes, I suppose) 😀 But on a more serious note, I think one of the most endearing qualities of the whole show for me is Merlin’s empathy. And especially a fact that he’s a MALE character who displays empathy. That’s absolutely endearing. And attractive as hell. Also, Colin Morgan is really good at playing empathetic characters in general, I’ve never seen an actor so good at scenes where he’s just listening, not even given any lines! I suppose I’ll have something to say about it next week, too 🙂
“I’m rather surprised that he didn’t comment, “That was a bit of a stupid line, wasn’t it?” after Arthur big-mouth-no-trousers ‘burn’.”
Haha 😀 I’d love to see some meta-parody version of the show where Merlin says such things! Also, Merlin on a podcast about Merlin – damn, that’s an idea worth of a fic! 😀
26th October 2020 @ 7:10 pm
I think one of the most endearing qualities of the whole show for me is Merlin’s empathy. And especially a fact that he’s a MALE character who displays empathy. That’s absolutely endearing. And attractive as hell. Also, Colin Morgan is really good at playing empathetic characters in general, I’ve never seen an actor so good at scenes where he’s just listening, not even given any lines! –
Absolutely. The show does many things wrong but the notes about empathy and, yes, as you say, empathy also in men, is so valuable and basically what I love best about the show and makes (spoiler music!!!) watching Melrin’s development in some later seasons so painful. I also think that the show finds empathy for even the most vile character in some way or other.There is always something left unsaid or a background left unexplored that gives viewers the chance to ponder and, possibly, sympathise with these characters. I hate to say it, but we can even feel a level of empathy for the goblin. After all, it has been imprisoned for a long time. Okay, there are perhaps a few villains where I don’t feel this way (Witchfinder springs to mind) but it’s rare. And I think it’s what frustrates us so much about Morgana’s arc. We want to understand and sympathise with her side, even empathise with her. But because there is such a lack of motivation or explanation for her actions, we simply can’t as all reference points are gone or botched up and the more steady reference point of the Morgana of season 1 and 2 has, somehow, entirely disappeared.
26th October 2020 @ 4:50 pm
–I have a favourite bit of the podcast which is when you both simultaneously start quoting that awful Morgana line from 1.1. It IS the worst line. And sadly so memorable because of it.–
haha we would normally do another take on stuff like that, and re-record but really, this time, it helped to emphasize just how bad that bit really was!! lol
–Why doesn’t Elyan share his horse with Gwen, who is his sister, instead of Merlin, who is a complete stranger? It’s a tiny thing but it always bugs me because there is no sense in it.–
on a horse basis… gwen would have a smaller horse, due to being a horse suited for a lady, and therefore the additional weight would probably be too much, whereas Merlin’s going to have a bigger horse, used to carrying around big blokes, but also blokes in armour, so the additional weight wouldn’t bother the horse as much. meta-textually, it’s entirely possible that the reason is the same. That the horse Colin was using is able to carry more weight / actually trained to have people ride double on it, and the horse Angel was using may not have been able to. Story wise… I totally see where you’re coming from and think you’re probably right, and it’s not like it’s actually Gwen’s horse, because gwen doesn’t own a horse, but if Elyan was on her horse, he would almost certainly have to ride in the front due to size, height, weight distribution, and from what we know, Gwen’s horse may not like strangers, and Elyan may not know how to ride… and then there’s the bit where she’s a lady so you wouldn’t put her through that, and certainly Arthur wouldn’t, whereas Merlin is just a (male) servant (and Arthur isn’t worried about treating him like a lady) and let’s face it, Merlin probably offered, didn’t he?
So like, yeah, I get where you’re coming from, but actually, i think there’s plenty of reasons as to why they ended up in the configeration they ended up.
–Why does Arthur send Merlin and Morgana ahead of him after Merlin blew up the throne room? —
I assume it’s as simple as ‘if you’re in front of me I can keep an eye on you and I won’t loose you again, like I did last time’?
–In the scene afterwards, when Arthur hoists Morgana on his shoulders, everyone is so delightfully shouty. I want more of these characters bellowing at each other. Maybe a frustration or two would be released and everyone could be happier for it.–
hahaha scream therapy for everyone!
–All Arthur says is that Morgana is better with a sword but he never once dismisses Merlin’s help. In fact, in the later scene in the dungeons, he relies on Merlin to help him come up with and execute a plan.–
very very true. Sadly we all know that arthur will forget this within like, the next three episodes. but right this moment, it is awesome!!
–Merlin’s just so delightfully ‘un-swordy’!–
and yet, so very murder-y hahaha
M Xx
25th October 2020 @ 7:37 pm
This episode’s a weird one for me. There are definitely some problems and it never stands out to me much, but there are some parts of it I actually really like.
– Angel’s stunning performance throughout, but particularly when she crashes into Merlin in the corridor. The way she tries to come up with a reason, but can’t because she is so stressed and scared and her heart’s not in it, and then her voice breaks slightly when she says “I’m fine”…so amazing.
– the Merlin and Gwen moments are endearing and remind me of their sweet and simple friendship.
– I like the hints to past Morgana, with the sword-fighting competency and her rage at being carried by Arthur haha. But I also like that she is more civil to Arthur than she ever was in S1&2, it felt like she was making an effort to seem on his side so he doesn’t suspect her.
– Arthur’s “Well it’s like you said Guinevere, it’s what you do for someone you love” – I love them.
– Arthur’s competency is my favourite thing.
– Gwen and Elyan’s relationship, and Elyan in general!
I think there’s something interesting about Arthur playing the adrenaline junkie dare devil once again. That’s the vibe I got from Arthur’s scenes, particularly when he’s explaining Cenred’s desire for Camelot’s throne to Gwen and Merlin and talking to Merlin about not being “scared of pain” in the cell. It reminds of his “sounds like fun” in the Poisoned Chalice, however, this time I think he’s doing it to reassure Gwen and Merlin rather than himself, and encourage them to trust him. Considering what Ruth and Michelle were saying about Merlin NOT trusting Arthur in the Crystal Cave, and that he actually rarely does, it’s interesting that Arthur seems to be putting effort in to change that.
I don’t know if this is too far fetched, but I was thinking about something with the riding back to Camelot scene, where Arthur is so frustratingly waxing lyrical about Camelot’s loyalty and trust while Morgana is quite literally disloyal and untrustworthy. I know very little about the legends, but I wonder if this is playing into the tragic element of them, with Arthur almost tragic hero-esque due to him being too trusting while forces are at work to destroy Camelot. And, I’m fairly sure *ominous spoiler music!!!* that it is his trust in others that is his downfall in the end. We often have Merlin framed as the tragic hero, and I think will see more of that, but I’ve never thought of Arthur in that way before and wonder if it works…
LESSONS
I think Gwen learns that it’s okay to be scared and that courage is the overcoming of fear. There are a number of moments in the episode where the show seems to focus on Gwen being frightened, of the woods, Cenred cutting the rope, the skeleton and the whole situation in general. However, she perseveres for the sake of her brother, her friends and herself and she succeeds in helping to keep her loved ones safe. It feels so true to Gwen’s character, her quiet but strong bravery and I think this lesson bodes well for any future leadership occupations that might arise for her…
Arthur has learnt that Merlin is more competent than he give him credit for. When Merlin takes out the guard worth the sword, Arthur is shocked, even though it makes sense Merlin has picked up a few tricks spending so much time questing with Arthur. With Arthur’s gentle dismissal of Merlin’s swordsmanship earlier, I think we are reminded that he is used to thinking – Protect Merlin because he’s harmless and incompetent! – but maybe in this episode he realises maybe that’s not so necessary anymore. Regardless, I don’t think Arthur will ever stop trying to protect Merlin cause he’s sweet like that.
Finally, I have learnt that I am such a Morning-Arthur person in the morning, the whole sequence was distressingly relatable to watch – I now have even more endless sympathy for anyone I have ever made contact with before 10am in the morning, than I did before!
LESSONS OVER
As always, thank you so much for an incredible episode. I enjoyed thinking about this one! This write in is the size of Jupiter, I hope it’s not too long and rambly and makes some sort of sense😂.
26th October 2020 @ 5:02 pm
completely completely agree, angel is so so stunning in this episode and it’s sad that it turns out to be just a little bit forgetable.
And yes, that’s an interesting call out about Morgana being nicer than she’s ever been before. makes you think that Arthur should really notice that something is up, what with her being stupidly nice to him lol
-– Arthur’s “Well it’s like you said Guinevere, it’s what you do for someone you love” – I love them.—
AND SO YOU SHOULD THEY ARE THE BEST
Sorry, I just kind of keep forgetting just HOW MUCH I LOVE THEM!!! lol
26th October 2020 @ 7:50 pm
Absolutely! And yes they are the BEST, I too feel as though I had slightly strayed from the path of love for Arthur and Gwen, but can safely announce that I am back on track haha! These past few episodes have really really worked for their relationship, for me.
26th October 2020 @ 7:21 pm
I think this lesson bodes well for any future leadership occupations that might arise for her…
I should certainly hope so. But I think Arthur and Guinevere – that’s established legend, right? That’s not a spoiler anymore. 🙂 I actually think Gwen is the born leader but people who are humble, don’t need to be the centre of attention and are content to serve others are often disregarded in that respect. It is mostly the loudest shouters, those who flaunt their talents that, somehow, take the highest leadership positions when it should go to those more natural but more humble leaders. Dare I mention current politics? Probably not a good idea…But I wish there was a Gwen somewhere.
26th October 2020 @ 8:30 pm
Totally agree. And considering where Gwen ends up at the end of the show – spoilers here I’m pretty sure? – I certainly felt confident in her leadership and leaving Camelot in her hands – there was no one better, in my opinion. It makes me think of what Ruth and Michelle said in their Hogwarts House episode, about Gwen having to use her more essential Gryffindory traits as Queen. Her job, social status and life experience has made her value and present as Hufflepuff, but actually she is naturally brave and determined to do right (she often appears as the moral compass of the show) yet doesn’t feel the need to flaunt and show off about it. This allows her to focus on what she is trying to achieve – keeping loved one safe, protecting the citizens of Camelot from foes – rather than a personal desire to be great and go down in history. Not that there is anything wrong with that, but I think too much pressure on that can make one easily corruptible, and Gwen manages to stay true to doing what is right and best for Camelot. Your so right that often the greatest leaders are pushed aside by the louder ones who have the means to assume authority, because they shout louder and drown out the Gwens. It’s devastating to think what kind of wonderful world it would be if the Gwens were taken seriously and valued as leaders, and how much good they could do…and don’t you worry, I have a feeling we would agree politics-wise!
28th October 2020 @ 11:32 am
When I was typing the reply above I was actually also thinking about the Hosgwarts Houses episode and what has been said there about Gwen/ my own comments about her. 🙂
28th October 2020 @ 11:18 pm
Nice! Your comment clearly nudged me to think of that too! We were definitely on the same wavelength then😊
25th October 2020 @ 4:31 pm
Hi!
I’ve been listening to your podcast since the start of this pandemic. You guys do a fantastic job!
I’m usually more of a silent listener, but when Michelle asked for translations of the opening scene in Arthur’s bedroom, I couldn’t contain myself. So I went back and watched the scene again in my native language, German (which I wouldn’t recommend doing. Arthur sounds like the most big-headed, annoying snob in the world. Praise Bradley James’ voice).
Firstly, Merlin says “Raus aus den Feder“ / “Out of the feathers (?)“ which is apparently equal to “rise and shine“. It’s a commonly used saying, so it didn’t strike me as too odd. Then again, people didn’t start using feathers for their mattresses until the 18th century. But I’m happy to overlook this historical mistake, because it is not getting better… at all.
“Strezt die Knochen“ / “Stretch your bones“. I’m not sure what to say to, because
the first word doesn’t exist in this way. It’s a very good example of a very bad “let’s try to make it sound medieval and posh“ attempt.
I’ve never heard anyone say this before.
How am I supposed to stretch my bones?
“Aufstehen, nicht aufgeben“ / “Get up, not give up“ again, not a proverb and really confusing. What is Arthur not to supposed to give up? Getting out of bed? If so, leave the poor man alone!
“Die Sonne frohlockt, ein Lied erklingt…“ / “The Sun exults, a song raises…“ I thought this might be a start to a song or a poem. Turns out, it isn’t.
Well, It’s just a very weird scene. But it was fun going back to watch it in German 🙂 (haven’t done that in a while).
Oh, and fun fact: I think you mentioned, that you didn’t remember the episode by its title, since they’ve never mentioned the castle’s name. I guess the translators thought so too, because they’ve translated the title into “Abducted and blackmailed“. That gives the episode a very different charm (no wonder people usually think Germans are a little aggressive).
LESSON
(German) Arthur learns that he should appreciate Merlin’s good morning calls more, since Merlin’s imagination isn’t vivid enough to think of a proper alternative.
Thank you so much for your Podcast! Listening to it is one of my weekly highlights 🙂
Best wishes from Germany!
25th October 2020 @ 5:23 pm
Okay, you inspired me and I looked up the Polish version and I’m dying right now 😀
So, first of all, there isn’t a Polish dubbing, instead, they use a weird lector thing (it’s a very Polish thing apparently, when you still have the original audio on, but over the audio, the lector – just one guy – reads the Polish translation in a rather disinterested voice :D).
So the phrases they use:
“Pobudeczka” – I don’t really know how to translate it 😀 It’s something like “wake up”, but in a rather silly, childish way, as the word is used in diminutive. It’s something that would be used, I guess, by my parents’ generation.
“Otwórz oczęta” – “open your eyes”, but again, “eyes” are in diminutive (yeah, Polish can make a diminutive of every noun!). This is something a fairy godmother might say to a fairy-tale character.
“Podnieś główkę, leniuszku” – I died 😀 It’s literally “raise your little head, lazy one” (again, “head” and “lazy” in diminutive!). That’s something nobody would ever use 😀
26th October 2020 @ 8:41 am
wow! I 100% know what you mean because swiss makes diminutives out of EVERYTHING, and whenever I’m translating I’m like ‘no, you don’t understand just how bad this is! he didn’t just call him a croissant, which is bad enough, he called him a croissantette!!!!’ and it’s just really difficult to get across just how cringe and cutsey something is, to an english speaker who doesn’t have a language that obsessively makes things small and cringey lol but I certainly feel like I know exactly what you mean, and let me just say again.. WOW
M Xx
26th October 2020 @ 1:09 pm
Oh yes, my thoughts exactly! Also, what am I to do when my language doesn’t just make diminutives, it can make different versions of diminutives of the same word! Like with the “eyes” in my second example, the word they used is an old-fashioned, fairy-tale like diminutive; if someone wanted to use a normal, contemporary one, they’d have to say “oczka” instead of “oczęta” 😀 LOL this language is hard!
26th October 2020 @ 1:19 pm
oh wow. I’ve just sat here for like 5 minutes saying swiss words, and trying to make them diminutive in different ways. I’ve also found a surprising number of nouns that I don’t think even the swiss can make diminutive, but I may be wrong, I’m sure someone would find a way to do it hahaha languages are so weird!!
26th October 2020 @ 7:31 pm
“Podnieś główkę, leniuszku” – I died 😀 It’s literally “raise your little head, lazy one” – That, and only that, including all diminutives, should be Merlin’s new morning line!
As to the lector thing: I was on holiday in Poland in 2019 (before the world ended) and I was so excited when I discovered that they were showing Merlin on TV – but I was pretty horrified by the ‘talking over the actual voices’ bit. Maybe not the talking over so much but the guy (only one!) who was doing all the dialogue sounded either dead bored or close to death. Not sure which.
So, I watched it on silent because I knew the lines anyway. 😀
26th October 2020 @ 9:03 pm
I haven’t watched anything with the lector in a long time, so I’m not used to it anymore, but I remember being used to it as a child – it’s supposed to be a neutral voice “in your head”, almost as if someone turned on a speech app to read the subtitles. But I can very easily see how absurd it must sound when you’re not used to it 😀 Still always preferred it to the dubbing, because I can at least glimpse some original audio from the background! 😀
28th October 2020 @ 11:35 am
I think it’s truly what you’re used to. I think it was partly that I had really wanted to watch Merlin and then this person kept talking over the characters. I didn’t like that person intruding on my show! 😀
I think dubbing is a good idea for kids, especially when they can’t yet read. However, once children can read, I think the original audio + subtitles is the better approach. Then they can enjoy the original voices, learn foreign languages and improve their reading skills all while watching a show or movie they enjoy.
26th October 2020 @ 8:39 am
oh wow, that is… some translations lol we’ll probably talk about most of this on the podcast but thank you so much for going back and checking this for me!!!!
M Xx
26th October 2020 @ 7:25 pm
“Die Sonne frohlockt, ein Lied erklingt…“ / “The Sun exults, a song raises…“ – I wish Merlin had said that in English! And then started singing and dancing around the room. Arthur’s expression would have been priceless.
I actually really like Arthur’s voice in German but I remember finding it hard telling him apart from Merlin. I think the voice casting isn’t that great as they are not distinct enough. Anyway, I prefer Bradley James and Colin Morgan’s actual voices anyway.
27th October 2020 @ 1:22 pm
That would have been so funny! Goodbye to their last shared brain cell 😉
I always find it hard to switch back to the dubbed version after hearing the original one. Their German voices just sound wrong to me. Merlin’s voice is too high pitched (I always lose it when he calls Kilgharrah, it’s not majestic at all) and if you’ve ever wondered how to draw a link between Titanic and Merlin, here it is: Bradley James’ and Leonadro DiCaprio’s voice actor is the same 🙂 Oh, and I remember having difficulties telling them apart too.
28th October 2020 @ 11:21 am
I guess it doesn’t bother me to much because I only ever watch it in German when I rope my parents into watching it with me. And then, I guess, I find it curious and refreshing.
Is that the same voice actor as the guy for Titanic? How old is he??? Arthur was meant to be 20 something at the start but clearly that guy has been in business for ages. 🙁
True, Merlin’s voice is too high for him. But it would be silly to cast for a voice like Colin Morgan’s. His is just too unique. 🙂
25th October 2020 @ 3:15 am
Hi!
I’m a long time listener but an infrequent commenter.
I think this episode does a really good job highlighting the underlying class issues in Merlin. I’ve always felt that the idea of class has been central to the relationships of the show— Gwen and Morgana have always been somewhat distant because of the gap in their social statuses, and a major reason why the connection between Merlin and Arthur is so special is because it is able to overcome their class differences. What’s interesting about this episode is that it implicates that an important factor in Morgana’s sudden shift to evil is her class prejudice: she thinks servants have less worth than people like her. In the beginning of the episode, we see Gwen leaving a sleeping Morgana in a luxurious room before going out into the cold to her notably less luxurious home. When she’s dragged away, we see Morgana smirking at her from the window, literally looking down on her. Then, when Morgana and Merlin argue in the woods, she throws the wood at his feet so he has to finish the work alone, reminding him of his lower class and therefore inferiority. It’s worth nothing that Morgana’s class issues aren’t exactly new this season, as her behavior towards Gwen has always been somewhat dismissive and almost patronizing, but they were probably magnified by the presence of Morgause. We know for a fact that that Morgause views servants as subhuman— in “The Fires of Idrisholas” she insists on referring to Merlin as “boy” instead of by his name, and is sure to point out that he’s just a servant, and therefore has no place questioning her.
This spills into another point of contention: why Morgana won’t just kill Merlin. Personally, I believe it stems from her desire for power and control. Morgana clearly takes delight in harassing Merlin and reminding him that he is powerless against her. In a way, his lack of power fuels her confidence in her own. While this is a stupid and short-sighted choice, Morgana has proven that her actions, in contrast to those of Morgause, are controlled by her emotions instead of long term goals. We’ve seen Morgana grapple for control in the earlier seasons too, albeit more benevolently. All of her struggles with Uther, particularly over Alvarr, have not been about her principles so much as her desire to have some kind of power. From the beginning, class has been one way she could always find that power, so it makes sense she would keep clinging to it, especially in her interactions with Merlin, someone who was able to manipulate her in the past. She probably feels the need to make up for the fact that he was able to overpower her, so by keeping him around she is able to exert control over him in the only way she knows how.
26th October 2020 @ 1:42 pm
thank you for writing in! we’ll hopefully get a chance to discuss this on the podcast, so I won’t go into a long response here, only to repeat myself in a bit haha If we shouldn’t get round to discussing it on air, please feel free to poke me to come back!! haha
M Xx
26th October 2020 @ 7:36 pm
Wow, that’s super interesting, Ana. But I think you’re absolutely right about Morgana relying on her class and power and, now, also her family bloodline. Perhaps another reason that Morgana doesn’t just kill Merlin is because she is so dismissive of him as a servant. She may not even consider him. She tells him that he should stop meddling in things that don’t concern him but perhaps that’s all she sees: someone who is meddlesome but otherwise unworthy of her notice. The fake nights in the Gwaine episode similarly dismissed Merlin: what can he say against us, he’s just a servant.
26th October 2020 @ 8:51 pm
That’s a great point! It definitely feeds into the idea that a huge part of Merlin’s effectiveness comes from being invisible: Uther would never think to investigate him for sorcery because his dismissiveness prevents him from acknowledging that Merlin is intelligent enough to fool him.
26th October 2020 @ 9:09 pm
I also thought this was so fascinating. I love your idea of Morgana’s ambition being for power, gaining and maintaining it – I wonder if this is because she lost so much power and control over her own emotions and actions when her magic first began to show in s2, so she needs this power to feel safe. With her new much crueler s3 self, it makes so much sense that she find it reassuring to exert power over Merlin by taking advantage of his inferior status, and I totally agree that her whole – I’m better than you, little servant – feels so vital to Merlin and Morgana’s current relationship. It reminds me of shot at the end of S3E2 when Morgana is praised for outwitting the traitor – she stares at Merlin and smirks as if to say and what are you going to do about it? Which I think speaks to the dismissiveness Mary talks about.
26th October 2020 @ 10:43 pm
I absolutely agree. When I was younger and watching this show for the first time I was a bit obsessed with Morgana, which made me incredibly disappointed when rewatching about how poorly written her narrative actually is. That being said, her under-baked storyline gives fandom the opportunity to interpret her character as they see fit, contributing something essential to the show. This definitely isn’t an excuse for bad writing, but I take comfort in the fact that I as a viewer can use my own opinions and thoughts to read into her actions how I choose (I might be a bit biased though because I’m currently writing a Morgana-centric fic that deals explicitly with the role of power and control in the deterioration of her moral character).
27th October 2020 @ 10:39 pm
I also absolutely loved Morgana the first time I watched this – and completely agree that it was so frustrating when her narrative arc felt wrong and made no sense. I too was very young when I first watched the show and don’t remember much, but I do know that I found confident, challenging and determined Season 1 Morgana so inspiring as a female character – in retrospect, what does happen to her as a female character is ironically, awful! You are completely right though, that while it doesn’t excuse the bad writing, it does provide us so much material to work with, think about, talk about. If you are comfortable with giving it, and it is totally fine if not, do you have a name for your Morgana fic I can find it by? It sounds absolutely amazing and I would love to read it as long as that’s okay with you! I found her overall deterioration arc in the show – although when examined closely, frustrating – fascinating and devastating and so tragic in the bigger picture and when you apply your idea of power and control, it works so well!
28th October 2020 @ 2:21 am
Sure! It’s called Queen of Darkness by artemis_fay on ao3. Thank you for asking!
28th October 2020 @ 9:43 am
Not at all, thank you so much!
25th October 2020 @ 1:56 am
A thought on ‘the only sex-positive characters on this show are evil’. I don’t see Arthur and Gwen not taking any steps to be intimate as sex-negative. There are still groups of people who follow the sex-after-marriage thing due to religious or cultural practices. As long as it’s not something oppressive or toxic, it’s a choice that should be respected. Additionally, there are young people who might be interested in starting a physical relationship but just not ready yet or a bit nervous, which is something I see in Arthur/Gwen at times. If those groups find representation in the Arwen story I think it’s something progressive and promotes diversity. Though I don’t think it’s deliberate and probably has more to do with the show’s ‘family’ rating. Something to think about, especially as we go into episode 10. (However, come season 5 and I might have to contradict my positive stance…)
I agree the scary forest was actually pretty! Though I love that the scene allowed a glimpse into Arthur’s childhood and he shares that personal moment with Gwen. I have mixed feelings about how the Merlin-Morgana thread is handled, but just for this episode I really like their tension and how Merlin gets a little ruthless.
26th October 2020 @ 12:40 pm
thanks for the write in! We’ll hopefully talk about the sex-positive stance in the next episode, so I won’t go and repeat myself here. If we don’t manage to get it in the podcast, poke me and I’ll come back hahaha
but yes, completely agree that any insight into Arthur’s life before we met him is fantastic and yes, I love that he’s sharing it with Gwen, as the doesn’t share very often, does he? poor broken puppy with all of his issues… 🙁
M Xx
24th October 2020 @ 5:59 pm
I really enjoyed this episode, probably more than most others by the sounds of it, as its one that I do remember watching more when I was younger (along with next week’s episode). I like it because of the introduction of Elyan as it is another development in the world building of a Camelot to come (spoilers!) and the quest element of infiltrating the castle I thought was pretty cool. Looking at it as an adult now though I do totally appreciate the flaws you pointed out, especially why Morgause and Morgana don’t just get rid of Merlin already but I guess when your name is the title of the show you just gain immunity! :’)
-I think the opening scene after credits is a clever choice because the light-heartedness of it and random humour is a stark contrast to the darkness of Gwen’s abduction that we have just seen, showing how completely unaware everyone is at this moment in time of the peril that Gwen is in.
-Morgana is using the knowledge she has gained from last week’s episode about Arthur and Gwen’s feelings for each other which I think is a really neat follow-up. By giving this information to Morgause and Cenred she is testing their relationship further to see how far they will really go and to determine whether or not this will be the ultimate Achilles heel for Arthur’s downfall, and therefore Camelot.
-The death stare that Morgana gives Merlin when he tries to offer everyone more beans makes me laugh every time, its a proper “if looks could kill” moment and Katie McGrath totally nailed it!
-I like the dynamic between Arthur and Merlin when they are in the cell together. Arthur is showing himself to be quite calm as he tries to come up with an escape plan which ties in with the idea of him feeling responsible for everyone whilst Merlin is quite edgy and nervous because all he can think about is them being tortured. The antics of their escape really echoes the buddy moves they had going on in the ‘Lancelot and Guinevere’ episode and I like how Merlin pushes Arthur into the path of the jailer this time as opposed to Merlin being pushed by Arthur like in ‘L&G’.
-And as you guys said, the final scene is so lovely and makes my heart full 🙂
LESSONS
– We learn that, once again, Uther’s attitude to servants has not changed as he talks about them as if they are dispensable despite the extremes that both Merlin and Gwen have gone to over the years for the sake of Camelot and its people. It must be quite a kick in the teeth for Merlin considering he is standing right there when Uther disregards Gwen’s services 🙁
– I think Gwen is also beginning to learn that she doesn’t really trust Morgana anymore and is getting vibes that something in her has changed. Their encounter when Gwen “returns” to Camelot is particularly cold and you get the sense that Gwen doesn’t really believe what Morgana is saying and Morgana seems as if she is really struggling to act happy that Gwen is back, indicating how much her hatred is intensifying. We also learn that Gwen and Elyan did once have quite a close bond because of the way he works out the relationship she has with Arthur. Whilst they have been apart for a long time and Gwen is frustrated at Elyan for numerous things, like not being around when their father died, this will likely become water under the bridge pretty quickly because of their close bond from the past.
– I think Merlin learns and properly acknowledges how protective he is of his friends, especially Arthur, when talking to Morgana and I love the way Colin delivers the line “they do concern me, because they’re my friends too and I’ll do whatever it takes to protect them”. I think it really helps to cement that and shows him understanding how much Morgana does not care for them anymore. Perhaps this is him also clearing his conscience about things that have gone on between him and Morgana in the past? Yes he is reminded that he poisoned her (even though he was justified to do it pretty much) but he has also recently saved her life in ‘The Crystal Cave’ (although Morgana doesn’t know it) so in a way I guess you could say the slate is clean (and Merlin did do both of those things for the sake of everyone around him and to stop their suffering). He is now fully acknowledging this and knows that he cannot let Morgana’s plans get anymore out of hand but needs to go about it in smarter way.
Thanks again for a fab podcast! 😀
26th October 2020 @ 1:12 pm
there does seem to be an overall sense of ‘meh’ about this episode, so it’s nice to hear that you enjoyed it!
I do think there are a lot of episodes of television where, certainly for me, it just doesn’t matter what the “actual quality” of the episode is, because of memory I have around it. Be that because it’s the first episode of a show you ever saw and just how much you fell in love with it straight away, or be it that you watched it around a time where it just made you really happy, and therefore you still associate it with that happiness.
–I think the opening scene after credits is a clever choice because the light-heartedness of it and random humour is a stark contrast to the darkness of Gwen’s abduction that we have just seen, showing how completely unaware everyone is at this moment in time of the peril that Gwen is in.–
good shout! makes perfect sense that when you’ve got a fairly dark intro to an episode, you need to chill a bit and remind people that for most of the time, this is the same happy silly show they enjoyed in the previous episodes, to keep them from running away… haha
–Morgana is using the knowledge she has gained from last week’s episode about Arthur and Gwen’s feelings for each other which I think is a really neat follow-up. —
true, and we should absolutely applaud the show for follow up and (almost) follow through, as they do not do that very often, and I will absolutely take this!!
— Katie McGrath totally nailed it!–
I do feel bad for Katie sometimes because she has so many fantastic moments, but those moments just kind of disappear within the general ‘urgh! morgana why??’ feelings that surround her entire story line 🙁
— I like how Merlin pushes Arthur into the path of the jailer this time as opposed to Merlin being pushed by Arthur like in ‘L&G’.–
I’m highly amused by it, and of course Arthur is being a weirdo and Merlin is absolutely right, he should be able to just deal with one dude, so why is he being difficult… though I do wish that Merlin shoved Arthur, so he could then sneak up behind the guy and do something clever. Literally emulating Arthur from the L&G episode.
If you wanted Merlin to be a bit rubbish still, you could even have him fail a little bit so he hits the dude, but of course it doesn’t knock the dude out, because it’s Merlin and he’s not strong enough of course, but it distracts the man enough so Arthur can knock him out, and then you can have Arthur roll his eyes and go back to the usual dynamic lol
M Xx
23rd October 2020 @ 10:58 pm
This is a difficult episode because in principal it should be a pretty solid and meaty quest episode; unfortunately it does just lack the oomph because there are not any big highlights. Often, scenes between Gwen and Arthur are very striking but they’re relatively low-key in this episode, which does normalise them together I guess, it’s certainly not unpleasant.
The costuming for this episode was a little off for me- mainly because Gwen looked like a cavewoman in that ridiculous fur thing! Maybe they were angling it so she was dressed down and working hard to free her brother- I suppose it would have fit with the beats of her being just as competent as Arthur in this episode- but it just was not a good look.
Morgause looked really dressed down and small going to see Morgana as opposed to her sexy, embellished look we’ve seen before with Cendred. I suppose she has to be small not to be noticed, but it also feels like she’s dressing down for Morgana- as if she is a bit beneath her. I would say it was because she was more relaxed around Morgana, but actually we got another beat this episode of Morgause telling Morgana that she isn’t enough- ‘Then your work isn’t done’. Again, Morgana does seem to take it to heart but doesn’t exhibit any anger towards Morgause, rather disappointed with herself- sort of feeding into the big-sister dynamic.
Arthur’s bit of dramatic irony at the end with Camelot being built on trust really worked for me, it made him seem so pitiful and as though he’s living in a fairyland of happiness, an aspect of him I do like to see sometimes (and a place I would like to visit!)= really played into the tragedy we are telling of Morgana’s betrayal.
LESSONS
-The audience learned about another side to Gwen- a side that is sceptical and rather angry at her brother when we’ve never really had anything but sweetness from her. I think this adds a good amount of depth, because for her to stay all rosy from this point would start to become a problem if the storyline is getting darker. The audience has learned that her patience is not without bounds and perhaps unlike Merlin, she does not forgive others at a detriment to herself- not that she doesn’t forgive Elyan, but she doesn’t shy away from questioning him and she saves him not because of anything anyone has said to her but because of who he is to her- unlike when Merlin is influenced by any of his awful advisors.
-Melrin learns that he can no longer reach Morgana. He thinks it is because she has grown cold, which the show would have us believe too but actually I think it is the way he does it that shows the real problem. I always think about how Merlin doesn’t fight very hard to keep Morgana on side, and I suppose this is his go at that, but he goes about it the wrong way! He tries to guilt trip her- which is not going to work and not simply because she doesn’t care but because guilt is the very thing she is fighting against. Her whole thing about accepting her magic has been rejecting the guilt is has come with- the guilt she is made to feel for just having it, and because of that I think she is essentially guiltless and remorseless from this point forward, and this is what Merlin should have learned.
-Arthur learns that it is good for him not to be the best at everything. He is used to helping everyone- like when he helps Gwen to take the bags of her horse (because he is Mr competent). However, when she returns the favour and lights the fire when he can’t, he seems disgruntled at first. The way she reminds him that she is a blacksmith’s daughter kind of highlights him as a bit childish, but I wonder if that’s partly the prince character he puts on. He has said he hates being beaten by girls before ( which I absolutely hate), but I wonder if he puts on this act to make Gwen feel her victory a bit more? It sounds a bit weird but he makes a connection with her through her being able to do something he can’t, and I think he realises that it is important to let yourself be a little less perfect sometimes because that is how you get close to people.
23rd October 2020 @ 10:59 pm
I did not just write Melrin I’m crying…
26th October 2020 @ 1:15 pm
it’s okay, I promise I’m not judging you <3
25th October 2020 @ 5:33 pm
While it’s sad that there seems to be an overall sense of ‘meh’ about this episode, it’s always very reassuring when other people feel the same way we do. makes me feel less bad! haha
–The costuming for this episode was a little off for me- mainly because Gwen looked like a cavewoman in that ridiculous fur thing!–
I am always reminded of the fur thing that morgana wore when they went to ealdor. I think a lot of this episode matches with the moment of truth, and the fur thing is just another throw back. this is clearly what they thought the medieval woman would wear on a trip in the woods…? lol
That’s an interesting note about the Morgana/Morgause costuming and makes me want to go back and track their looks throughout S3… I fear however while there is a huge amount of work that goes into the costume, generally costuming story telling really only happens with the boys in merlin. an ongoing frustration when it comes to morgana and dresses and outfits. Though I do like and am now quite keenly watching out for the green = jealous costuming note with morgana
–Arthur’s bit of dramatic irony at the end with Camelot being built on trust really worked for me, it made him seem so pitiful and as though he’s living in a fairyland of happiness, an aspect of him I do like to see sometimes (and a place I would like to visit!)= really played into the tragedy we are telling of Morgana’s betrayal.–
argh! there’s so much in this that makes me want to talk about season 5 arthur!!!!! but yes! all of that. YES!
M Xx
26th October 2020 @ 12:19 pm
Oh I hadn’t considered the Ealdor thing! that makes me feel more ok about the fur, I think it is a nice contrast, obviously then they were all united in purpose and trust whereas here this trip means something very different to all of them- like you have mentioned we often have conversations where participants mean two different things and I think this trip was very much that.
I also agree that not much thought does go into women’s clothing- it’s just to look pretty really so you can read into it but probably best not to take it as anything important.
I feel like Arthur’s heroism is just going to get more and more tragic :(((((( god I love him I am not ready to rewatch season 5 or 4 for that matter!!
26th October 2020 @ 1:14 pm
you’ve still got some months to harden yourself to the tragedy that is the end of merlin 🙁 🙁 🙁 🙁
Let’s face it, we’ll never be ready… each time you get around to it, we’re not ready 🙁
M Xx
26th October 2020 @ 8:01 pm
I also agree that not much thought does go into women’s clothing –
Sadly, I have to agree. It seemed the only thought given to the women’s clothing in Merlin ran along the lines of, “Shall they wear this little tease or shall we give viewers a night they’ll really remember.”
I do laugh though when I consider the designer considering outdoor/fighting clothes for the girls in this episode (or the Moment of Truth). They can do armour for the boys no problem. And Merlin always wears the same combo anyway. But I can imagine them spasming when they had to design something like that for the girls: gosh, how can we make it dress-down and pratical but still really feminine and sexy.
And that’s how the shoulder fur was born or Morgana’s really unflattering armour corset. (Still better than the necklace armour she wore in 1.10 though).
I also think it’s weird to have Gwen wear the fur thing in THIS epsiode when we’ve just heard (again) that she’s a seamistress. Even if just given a bit of fur, Gwen would have been able to sew something more practical and flattering out of it. I can literally see it falling off Gwen’s shoulder and having to constantly be readjusted throughout the journey. Silly.
23rd October 2020 @ 1:04 pm
As to frustrations and Morgana, I’ll see how it goes for me this time around, but I remember being actually relieved when (SPOILERS AHEAD) she’s no longer in Camelot, at least that means characters don’t have to pretend they don’t have brains and can’t communicate with each other any longer… but then Agravaine comes 🙈🤷♀️
23rd October 2020 @ 1:05 pm
Oh yeah, that was supposed to be a response to my previous thread, sorry about that 🙈
23rd October 2020 @ 10:24 pm
oh god I don’t even want to think about Agravaine… So awful I really hope we’re not past the best of Merlin but I really can’t remember! I do like when it gets darker but I remember Agravaine as another character that forces all the others to become brainless again.
24th October 2020 @ 12:08 am
I don’t want to discuss later seasons here at length, but I just want to say that, despite the Agravaine nonsense I really liked season 4! I always thought “if you could just skip his scenes, it’ll be great” 😛 We’ll see how it goes upon a re-watch 😀
24th October 2020 @ 10:26 am
excited and terrified in equal meassures… lol
M Xx
22nd October 2020 @ 2:52 pm
Hm, this episode doesn’t really do much for me, to be honest… there are just not enough highlights to make it very enjoyable, but it’s not like it’s totally bad either… so just few things here:
– I love how Merlin’s voice falters at “let’s have you, lazy daisy”, as in “it sounded really good in my head, now not so much really”. Also, thank you for explaining the expression! I had no idea that it’s something that actually existed 😀
– lovely moment of friendship between Merlin and Gwen, Merlin is so empathetic and caring. But, as you said, it really, really doesn’t make any sense that: Merlin covers for Morgana; Gwen doesn’t suspect Morgana; Gwen and Merlin somehow can’t share their suspicions and alert Arthur (and, of course, why doesn’t Morgana kill Merlin? That’s the question). And this problem, sadly, will continue, driving me mad *cue spoiler music*
– Elyan is a nice character, but I don’t have very strong feelings towards him just from this episode. Maybe it’s because any other characters “of that kind” (Lancelot and Gwaine) were very polarized and very characteristic, and Elyan looks a bit bland in comparison? No offense, Elyan-lovers 😉
– Merlin to Morgana: “I would protect them [my friends] no matter the cost” – well, that is quite interesting. Not the first time when Merlin has to make difficult decisions to protect Arthur and his friends, of course, but probably the first time he vocalizes it so strongly. Merlin’s slowly radicalizing, probably because of Morgana? I think the slow, slow descent into ruthlessness starts somewhere around here *ominous foreshadowing music*
– lastly, if Morgana’s evil smirking was part of the drinking game, this would be a very good episode to get drunk on.
LESSONS
Merlin learned that he really wants to protect Arthur no matter the cost. I believe he only realized it when he said it out loud. Of course, it’s not the first time he had to make difficult decisions to do that, but before, he either wanted to save everyone, even Morgana (with different results) or have real moral quandaries when it came to poisoning her. Now, he sounds almost brutal. Not that he acts on it immediately, but it’s the beginning, I believe.
Both Merlin and Gwen should learn to trust each other more and don’t worry about “offending someone’s feelings” when it comes to possible danger. Of course, if it happened, there would be no plot, so they didn’t learn.
Arthur learned that Gwen really cares for others, even when she’s mad at them. Which is important when it comes to their relationship, as well. I think it’s generally a nice episode when it comes to Arthur observing Gwen’s feelings, not for him for a change, but for Elyan.
23rd October 2020 @ 11:32 am
There seems to be a very strong reaction of ‘meh’ to this episode. I genuinly did not know what this episode was, until I got the ‘next week of Merlin’, mostly because the title is so utterly generic, and we’ve never referred to Cendre’d kingdom as anything to do with the castle name, so it’s not even like reading the title makes you go ‘ooooh, Cenred is back’ or any similar excitement. 🙁
–-I love how Merlin’s voice falters at “let’s have you, lazy daisy”, as in “it sounded really good in my head, now not so much really”–
absolyutely love that! and yeah, we’ve all been there, right? when you think something sounds great until you hear it coming out of your mouth and you wish the ground would swallow you whole where you stand…
—And this problem, sadly, will continue, driving me mad *cue spoiler music*—
I sort of knew that my frustrations started around season 3, but I thought that they were much more morgana centric, rather than everyone acting like complete idiots around Morgana 🙁
–– lastly, if Morgana’s evil smirking was part of the drinking game, this would be a very good episode to get drunk on.—
I am very glad we came up with the drinking game before season 3 even started as yes, we’d actually be dead from alcohol poisoning if that was included!!!!
M Xx
24th October 2020 @ 7:48 pm
« Merlin’s slowly radicalizing, probably because of Morgana? I think the slow, slow descent into ruthlessness starts somewhere around here »
Totally agree. This always felt so cold and upfront from Merlin and like you say, very reminiscent of Season 5 Merlin! Your right hat he’s acted like this many times before, but never been so straightforward with it. I hadn’t thought of it being stimulated by Morgana’s turning before, but that makes so much sense! Maybe it’s also a bit of a trust thing, as Morgana refers to Merlin’s as a previous friend when she says “No you just poison them”. Morgana was Merlin’s friend, and Arthur’s, and if she can turn bad and want to harm Arthur, anyone can. Maybe Merlin’s paranoid of the other enemies lurking and that’s part of what provoked his radicalisation, him reconsidering everyone he trusts and living in constant fear for Arthur and his destiny. I know that would drive me crazy!
Maybe it’s also linked to his – not sure how to put it and I certainly won’t get this right – obsession with keeping Arthur alive in season 5? Maybe haha. He’s lost so much faith in everyone else, perhaps subconsciously, apart from Arthur (Because Arthur can’t antagonise himself…or can he? That’s another discussion I think😂) so he clings to him as a kind of reassurance. Not that that’s the only thing feeling their immensely complex relationship at all, but perhaps it’s a factor.
24th October 2020 @ 8:48 pm
“Morgana was Merlin’s friend, and Arthur’s, and if she can turn bad and want to harm Arthur, anyone can. Maybe Merlin’s paranoid of the other enemies lurking and that’s part of what provoked his radicalisation, him reconsidering everyone he trusts and living in constant fear for Arthur and his destiny. I know that would drive me crazy!”
I think you’re absolutely right. A betrayal from someone close would cause trust issues in most people, and Merlin, moreover, has all the destiny thing going on, with constant prophecies not only about what Arthur has to do in the future, but also about what would be his doom. If Merlin had anyone to tell him that he doesn’t have to feel responsible for destiny, things might go different, but as it is, well… I think Merlin’s obsession in season 5 is the only-to-be-expected end result of this, and (unlike, I think, at least some of the fandom) I wasn’t surprised when it happened. Merlin is often convinced he has to let go of his normal, human feelings (like when the dragon tells him to let Mordred die, or to kill Morgana), but at least, with his love for Arthur, he knows it has the “destiny’s seal of approval”, so he clings to it as much as he can, because he believes that at least this relationship won’t have to be sacrificed on the destiny’s altar. No wonder Merlin becomes over-attached to Arthur, and that, in turn, makes him almost paranoid. Jeez, it’s so angsty, but I really believe that’s what the show is trying to tell us! 😀
26th October 2020 @ 8:45 pm
« Merlin is often convinced he has to let go of his normal, human feelings (like when the dragon tells him to let Mordred die, or to kill Morgana), but at least, with his love for Arthur, he knows it has the “destiny’s seal of approval” »
This is so so interesting. It makes me think of what both you and Mary were saying about Arthur being Merlin’s link to humanity – maybe because all other links have been lost, Merlin clings to Arthur partly BECAUSE he is his only, final link to humanity left. But, like you said, he also does it because his destiny allows it, and maybe the two combined makes it even stronger a pull. Destiny has cut off all else, therefore he focusses everything on Arthur because it is all he has to live for. So maybe Destiny becomes more of a logical problem than a reason (to Merlin) in the end. Yes, it forced him to come together with Arthur, but I’ve always felt that by the end it is Merlin’s love for Arthur, not destiny that drives him – evidence in the Disir, I think? Destiny got him there, enabled it and allowed it, but he cries for Arthur the friend, not Arthur the Destiny in that soul destroying scene. Wow, I have never thought of Destiny as the villain of Merlin, but goodness me it sounds like one! I hope I made sense there – have a feeling it was more of a thought explosion than anything else but hopefully it’s readable haha
26th October 2020 @ 9:14 pm
Yes, you definitely made a lot of sense 🙂
Destiny really does sound like the villain of the story to me – no matter if we assume that it’s real and a b*tch, or that it’s just a myth (which would make the dragon the villain, or, more interestingly, disperse the culpability entirely, as everyone who believes in destiny has their own reasons, not necessarily bad ones). But yes, Merlin definitely clings to Arthur really because of love, not destiny – but at least in my headcanon, he may be guilty about this love (“I’m Emrys, I’m not allowed human emotions, I shouldn’t be feeling that”), and then justify it by destiny (“But the dragon himself said we were two sides of the same coin! So that must be okay!”).
I hope I, in turn, make sense now 😀
27th October 2020 @ 11:08 pm
You do 100%!!
« which would make the dragon the villain, or, more interestingly, disperse the culpability entirely, as everyone who believes in destiny has their own reasons, not necessarily bad ones »
I think it is quite a popular head cannon that the dragon invented the destiny so that he would be free…of course it doesn’t work entirely as the druids all know about the Emrys thing, but maybe if we’re going with the myth idea, the druids clearly do really believe in the destiny, whereas I think you could absolutely say that Dragon just played into the myth to get what he wanted. Which is horrific when you put it all together, as he knew from the start how he was manipulating Merlin, and right until the end he keeps it up. He evens comes up with this new prophecy at the very end – and I actually was thinking the other day, what if the dragon merely dangles the possibility of *spoilers!” Arthur’s return just to keep Merlin alive in hope of preserving Albion – everyone else will die out, apart from Merlin himself, so he creates another prophecy to ensure Merlin and thus Albion will live, quite literally, forever. I kind of hate that idea though😂 Makes the end EVEN sadder, if that is even possible!
« he may be guilty about this love (“I’m Emrys, I’m not allowed human emotions, I shouldn’t be feeling that »
Love this. I’ve always wondered whether Merlin is actually technically human, but definitely more importantly is whether HE thinks he is. I’ve never thought about it before, but I can totally see himself actively trying to cut off human emotion in order to remain true to being « Emrys » and then pouring all of that bottled up feeling into his relationship with Arthur. So ironically, in emotional bottle-up levels, he and Arthur switch!
« But the dragon himself said we were two sides of the same coin! »
I wonder if another factor to the – I can’t have humanity or emotions – Merlin is that he’s also come to see himself as part of Arthur and literally not « whole » by himself. So back to this idea of not being human, and instead simultaneously the most revered sorcerer of myth and less than a person, more an extension of another human being. The contrast is crazy and I think one of the things the show can do pretty well.
28th October 2020 @ 1:47 am
“I think it is quite a popular head cannon that the dragon invented the destiny so that he would be free…”
Yes, I’ve heard it here and there 🙂 I have to confess, I have my own crazy head cannon, in which the destiny myth was invented by Taliesin (as he is a bard, after all, and bard=prophet in many early medieval cultures), then taken up by the druids (as they seem to revere Taliesin? Maybe if he took his magic from the Crystal Cave itself then he was the first human to have it? Idk), and the dragon, an almost all-knowing creature that he is, heard about it, maybe spiced it up to match the exact circumstances of Merlin and Arthur’s lives, and used it, first to make Merlin free him, then to make Merlin act like he wants him to (as he is the dragonlord and it would be very inconvenient for the dragon if Merlin was to exert his power over him, contrary to his will). And yes, this logically makes the dragon’s promise from the end of season 5 even more tragic 🙁 Though I was never entirely sure if Merlin stays immortal just because he’s waiting for Arthur, or because he has kinda “renewed” himself in the Crystal Cave. That is a discussion for another time, though 😉
“So ironically, in emotional bottle-up levels, he and Arthur switch!”
That’s such a perfect way to sum it up! And it’s really there in Colin’s and Bradley’s performances, too.
“I wonder if another factor to the – I can’t have humanity or emotions – Merlin is that he’s also come to see himself as part of Arthur and literally not « whole » by himself. So back to this idea of not being human, and instead simultaneously the most revered sorcerer of myth and less than a person, more an extension of another human being. The contrast is crazy and I think one of the things the show can do pretty well.”
Yes, yes, my thoughts exactly! 🙂 🙂
28th October 2020 @ 11:13 pm
Wow, that is one incredible idea, and makes a scary amount of sense! I wonder if you think that Taliesin believes that his myth is a prophecy that came to him or just wanted to mess with peoples lives for fun – yikes. And yes, that makes the dragon’s motivation make a lot more sense! – I always wonder how much he knows, but maybe he could tell from simply being around Merlin that he was a soon to be dragonlord, and would one day control him, so like you said that was a reason for the dragon’s manipulation.
I change my mind on that one quite a lot to be honest, I have to say quite often I go with that he can’t die a “mortal” death because he is “magic itself” and you can’t kill, eradicate pure magic (not sure if that quite works but it’s what I’ve always gone with😂) but if he really wanted to, he could use Excalibur to kill himself. And so he chooses not to because he is waiting for Arthur – but you are totally right, it is a conversation to save for a later date…
“it’s really there in Colin’s and Bradley’s performances, too.”
It totally is! They do it so subtly and argh it’s so amazing.