Episode III.IV – Gwaine
Join us for the delight of meeting Gwaine, in epsiode 4 of Season 3 of BBC Merlin!
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15th October 2020 @ 11:36 pm
I loved this episode. Gwaine is really an amazing character and I like him even better than Lancelot, mainly because he has so many flaws. I haven’t much to say about this episode other than I’d put it much higher, more like 5 or 6 on your ratings list (certainly before the Fires of Ican’tspellthatname), but then I fell for Gwaine the second he swished his hair!
19th October 2020 @ 12:39 pm
no one can spell that word. it’s probably my most googled and copy and pasted thing in Merlin haha
6th October 2020 @ 10:14 pm
ok so ive missed the first 2 but i am back now and im ready to dive headfirst into season 3.
first of all, i loved this episode as gwaine is my favorite knight. its a very merlin and Arthur centered episode, we don’t see much of Gwen and i don’t think Morgana is in it at all. i don’t know, i feel like there are 3 types of merlin episode, the tournament fighty ones, the ones where one character causes a big problem, and the questy ones. as with all episodes involving gwaine there is a lot of comedy which i love because i think hes just hilarious. merlin and gwaines friendship is the best though, they are like children getting into trouble and messing around together, its even funnier when arthur is stood there going ‘what on earth’. Uther annoyed me again this episode, he does nothing other than shout at people as usual. Giaus wasnt as bad as he usually is, i thnk its because he actually has a job to do so is not just there because he said so. but honestly what on earth is gwaine doing with his life? 4 dozen pickled eggs???!!!!
LESSONS:
Merlin learns not to open his big mouth because it never ends well. but will he ever learn? he also learns that it is not a good idea to run his hands along the blade of a sword because it seems he has to be told how to not do stupid things.
Gaius learns not to say something merlin disagrees with when he has a mouthful, he will get soup all over his face.
Arthur learns to be more specific instead of saying ‘anything’ because Gwaine will take it literally and spend £200 at the tavern
Gwaine is just hilarious and doesnt really learn anything and uther ignores everyone as usual
13th October 2020 @ 11:00 am
I think you’re totally right about Gaius. Generally when he’s got something proper to do in the episode, he has less time to be an idiot. But then there are unfortunately also the episodes where he does have lots to do, but turns out, he is aweful at his job… so it goes 50/50, really =/
6th October 2020 @ 9:11 pm
ahhhhhhhh, i was so caught up in what fraction of a social life i had, i missed the start of season 3 :(. oh well, i am not quite as obsessed now because i found evanescence by listening to a morgana playlist someone made so now im stuck as the most hardcore evanescence fan you will ever meet. im still gonna write paragraphs about how annoying giaus is though 🙂
13th October 2020 @ 3:16 pm
ah man, evanescence… there’s some teen angst memories that I have not thought about in a long time… ENJOY!!! <3 <3 <3
M
5th October 2020 @ 9:03 am
I just noticed the mistakes in my comment and I’m so sorry, it is currently very late where I live and my brain is not being grammatically correct. Forgive me and I hope it makes some sense!🤦🏻♀️
5th October 2020 @ 9:01 am
I love this episode! Gwaine is one of my favorite characters. So things I love about the episode. I love Merlin’s friendship with Gwaine and how it develops. There’s a mutual liking and really sweet moments.
Arthur and Merlin have good moments too. Their banter is almost always enjoyable for me and I loved the playful shoving in the end. And it was kinda cute to see mild jealousy from Arthur when he saw Gwaine and Gwen talking.
I don’t know why but the way Arthur picked up the paper when showing Merlin the bill was genuinely hilarious to me.
I think Gwaine’s sort of self destructive behavior comes from having trouble making friends. What I mean is when you pointed out how him drinking and passing the buck to Merlin was sort of a dirt bag move to make. But what if the way he’s that way to people who seem to be his friends because he figures they’ll tire of him eventually so why hold back now. He cares about their well-being and is willing to put himself on the line for them but he doesn’t necessarily expect that to be reciprocated. As he said, he doesn’t typically stay in one place for too long. And there’s a sort of vulnerability and self preservation sort of? Idk if that makes sense.
LESSONS(I guess I’m not very good at thinking of what to say😅)
Gwaine learned that Arthur truly was a good man as Merlin and Gwen had told him despite his mistrust in nobles. He also learned that despite his general experience, he can make friends who like having him around.
Merlin learned once again that as fate would have it, he can’t have normal friendships or bonds outside of his destiny, not for long it seems. He’s always isolated even in his relationship with Arthur he has to keep secrets from him. It must be so lonely to be Merlin, especially when he’s such an eager friend. I hate it for him.
Arthur learned, not for the first time, that his father and the knights code can be wrong, and he willingly admits it. He also learned that some people find Merlin more attractive than him.*cue pouty Arthur*
In conclusion, I loved the episode and your commentary! Can’t wait to see Gwaine again! *ominous music*
5th October 2020 @ 11:28 am
–I don’t know why but the way Arthur picked up the paper when showing Merlin the bill was genuinely hilarious to me.–
completely agree. bradley is a very good comic actor, and that’s because of his comic timing but also because of his mannerism and face pulling. like, there are so many moments of merlin where even just thinking of what bradley does with his face makes me laugh out loud, no matter where I am haha
–And there’s a sort of vulnerability and self preservation sort of? Idk if that makes sense.–
completely completely agree! I said this above somewhere, but it’s quintessential ‘leave them, before they can leave you’ and clearly Gwaine comes with a whole boat load of issues, and we’ve only just scratched the surface of them!
5th October 2020 @ 2:53 pm
It must be so lonely to be Merlin, especially when he’s such an eager friend. –
Oh, that’s so so true. Merlin would be the kind of friend you’d be fine to call at any point and he’s be right over, bringing you tissues and food. He’d truly listen and give up anything to make you feel well and loved. He does not deserve to be so lonely. However, I’ve actually seen this happen on real life. People who always give and never take; they can be so easily exploited and taken for granted. They pour everything into a relationship but when they need someone, no one is there for them, providing the same level of care and comfort. 😢
5th October 2020 @ 9:44 pm
Exactly!!! It’s so sad! And idk I can relate a little😅 definitely not to that extent though. I just wanna give him a hug😢
5th October 2020 @ 10:59 pm
Me too. Hugs are so underrated. Who knows, if Arthur had given Merlin that hug in season 2, maybe that whole destiny would have played out completely differently because Merlin would have known he wasn’t alone and would have had more confidence going to people for help.
This kind of links with our discussion further down of why on earth Merlin doesn’t go to Arthur to tell him about those magic swords: he’s alone and doesn’t think anyone would listen or support him. So, he thinks he needs to figure out all by himself. He just doesn’t get hugged enough to know better. Poor Merlin!
6th October 2020 @ 12:19 am
Oh, I can see Merlin unites us 😉 I can definitely relate to this aspect of him, too 😉
4th October 2020 @ 1:09 pm
My comments/ lessons are a little mixed up this week – sorry. I tried to make things more obvious by putting ‘Lesson’ before the paragraph with, well, the lesson. The rest is often extension of the lesson through semi-lucid (or semi-ludicrous) commentary. 😊
LESSON: I have learned/ slowly come to the conclusion that the tavern scene at the beginning made absolutely no sense and its only function was to give Gwaine a suitable character introduction (which it did). However, it complicates the narrative of the episode and creates more plot holes than it solves (if any).
Firstly, you said that Arthur might agree to go to the tavern with Merlin because it’s outside of Camelot borders but later he promises military support which, as we know from 1.10, Uther wouldn’t even give an entire village that was starved and threatened by bandits.
Then, I am really confused what happened to all of Dagr’s men. Did Arthur kill all but the lone companion (called Ebor if we are to believe IMDB)? That’s pretty brutal – they weren’t bandits or murdering people. They were looking to make money quickly. If Arthur hasn’t killed them – why didn’t they re-join Dagr?
Also, Arthur just left Dagr there in the stocks. And then? At some point, the villagers would have to release him and then, surely, he’d get his revenge eventually, but now he’d demand more than money. It’s only lucky that Dagr & Co decided to take revenge on Arthur instead of all the weaker people in the village that would NOT have been quick enough to send for help from Camelot.
I also find the tavern scene problematic in other respects: Arthur, when responding to the would-be compliment by Mary, is shown to be vain and a little boastful about his appearance. Now, maybe I’ve just forgotten, but I cannot ever remember Arthur being vain. A bully, prideful of his skills but never arrogant about his appearance. Once again, character consistency is sacrificed to land a joke. And they could have still had the joke without discrediting Arthur. Any response from him would have produced the same effect when Mary then corrects him and compliments Merlin instead. (I’m SO happy this lady is called Mary. I’d compliment Colin Morgan as well. 😊)
LESSON: Additionally, I don’t think Gwaine is as heroic as he is made out to be for helping them in the tavern fight. Arthur says, “You better get out while you still can.” Erm…maybe it’s just me but no one could have gotten out at that point. The thugs all blocked the exit. Everyone in there was in the fight whether they liked it or not. If anything, Gwaine stupidly started a fight that might have ended really badly for a lot of innocent people. So no, he wasn’t heroic and brave. He didn’t have a choice to get away and decided to run with it, presumably because he liked the odds?
LESSON: Once again, we learn that Camelot timing works differently: Let’s take a quick look at the miraculous timing of Dagr’s revenge plan: A random bloke stops him from collecting his tavern shares and locks him in the stocks. Only ONE day later, Dagr has already come up with a convoluted revenge plot, thought about the magical blunt swords, located the guy who is selling them, pre-arranged the pick up and price before actually picking them up, found (and possibly done background research) Sir Oswald and Sir Ethan, intercepted them to ride to Camelot in their place. I mean, how fast are these guys? Or are we meant to assume that lots of time has passed since the brawl and the morning when Arthur asks about how Gwaine is doing and sees the first knights arrive for the melee? The show doesn’t make me think that. And if that’s true: where was Merlin sleeping all that time with Gwaine occupying his bed?
However, I have come up with a bit of a headcanon/ explanation for the Dagr/ tavern scene conundrum. I started thinking about this when you discussed the writer’s mistaken use of the word ‘rightful’. What if Dagr and his thug friend really felt like it was their rightful place to be in the melee? You pointed out the episode’s many parallels to Lancelot but perhaps there is even more to it than that. Dagr and his friend might present us with a version of the Lancelot character if he hadn’t been given new hope by Gwen in 2.4. Both fake Oswald and Ethan are very good with a sword and with daggers, at horse-riding and mimicking knightly manners to be mistaken so long for their dead originals. They have intelligence to think of a convoluted plan to get revenge on Arthur and to carry it out until they are stopped by Gwaine and Merlin. Maybe these two, just like Lancelot, grew up training and hoping one day to be knights of Camelot only to be laughed at and turned away because they were a) not of noble birth and b) not pretty enough for the show’s coding of the good side (☹ Actually, that might be the reason they gave the actor of Sir Oswald such an abominable haircut. He needed to be handsome enough to credibly pass for a ‘good’ knight but also brutish-looking so that his more nefarious motives and actions as fake Sir Oswald could be coded in line with the rest of the show).
Then what almost happened to Lancelot happened to them: they began earning their keep the only way they know how: with force and weapons. Eventually, Dagr shed his original name, gave himself a nickname reflecting his skill with knives and became leader of thugs, demanding shares from local businesses.
Anyway, Arthur turning up and spoiling their business just gave them another reason to hate him and to exact their revenge which, at this point, they had been planning for quite some time and thus could act on it so suddenly.
LESSON: I have learned that David Moore (the director of this episode) is probably the least afraid for being realistically brutal and physical of all the Merlin directors (so far). I remember him most from ‘The Moment of Truth’ which was obviously, by its very nature, quite brutal, especially since it showed the first significant loss for Merlin. In this episode, it’s really obvious in so many details: The heavy metal sound design when Arthur throws the goblet at Merlin (I wince every time – not okay!), the blood when Merlin slices his finger with the sword, showing Sir Oswald’s servant being brutally killed for no reason, the way the fake knights torture Merlin before they intent to run him through. Even when Gwaine hits his head in the tavern and passes out, it feels really realistic and the sound design is, shall we say, very frank and honest?
LESSON: We learn that Arthur has no concept of hospitality. He tells Gaius to look after Gwaine and give him everything he needs. But he doesn’t even realise that Merlin has to give up HIS OWN BED for the man who saved his life. Surely, Arthur could have arranged for other accommodations or another bed if Gaius wanted to keep an eye on Gwaine? Then, he never goes back to talk to him whatsoever and only asks Merlin once how Gwaine is doing. (I don’t know why Arthur so fervently asserts that Gwaine is a good man or that he recognised his fighting style – he hasn’t bothered to exchange more than two words with the man nor seen him fight with a sword ever.) Then he makes Merlin responsible for letting Gwaine spend all this money in the tavern even though he’s just given Merlin to his knight friends, so his servant would have been too busy to look after ARTHUR’S guest! Also, would Arthur really have wanted to see his manservant and the man who saved his life strung up by a tavern keeper? I know it’s played for comedy but Merlin is only there for the conversation with Gwaine. Otherwise, Gwaine and what he does and spends is honestly not his problem. I think the writers hoped we wouldn’t notice?
LESSON: We learn that the writers thought it a great idea to continue the ‘Merlin is a thief’ narrative from last week. What were the fake knights to think to find a servant in their room, holding one of their (absurdly large) crystal necklaces in their hands? Also, we learn that Merlin bears a charmed life (er…ominous future music cue?) because no one kills him when they absolutely could. Or even accuses him. Instead, the fake knights play knife throwing when they could literally have dragged him before the king as soon as he was discovered in their rooms. And I’ll never understand why, when Gwaine was dragged in chains to Uther, Merlin wasn’t arrested or accused at the same time. I mean, Oswald and Ethan had all they needed to get him quite credibly convicted and they knew he was on to them. Why were they being merciful to him when only moments before they went out of their way to ‘play with their food’ before impaling him on a sword for supposed theft?
I also have issues with the entire melee scene. You pointed out that Merlin’s voice becomes a running commentary. Clearly, they realised in post that their battle was really confusing and had Colin Morgan do extra ADR. But it so clearly was recorded afterwards and it’s uncomfortable because it’s so obviously for audience benefit. It feels a little patronising. It also feels a little demeaning for Colin Morgan. ☹
LESSON: We (and possible Merlin) learn that Arthur will never be satisfied that he has won the trust of his people. How often does he have to prove that he’s fit to lead? He gives that excuse whenever Merlin prompts him to withdraw from a duel or battle or melee. I mean, it’s really sad actually to think that Arthur always assumes he never manages to deliver sufficient proof of his leadership abilities for his citizens.
Finally, I do actually really like this episode even though I am not the greatest fan of Gwaine. (sorry, please don’t get out the pitchforks – as Michelle said, you can definitely do a lot of stabbing damage!)
I am always really surprised and amused when the man falling through the door/ window of the tavern isn’t the one Gwaine originally punched. The momentum and editing always suggests it’s the same guy but it isn’t. It’s quite disorientating.
I love that there are two moments when it’s pointed out by Arthur (more reluctantly) and Gaius (who is so beautifully proud and pleased when he looks at Arthur), that Merlin is really learning to be a good servant/companion and physician. Gosh, that was one moment when I actually really liked Gaius. Just one moment though. Again, please restrain your pitchforks!
I like the tavern brawl because we see Arthur and Merlin fighting side by side using their respective talents. Also, if you just listen to the dialogue in that scene, it’s literally Arthur calling, “Merlin” to warn him and then Merlin calling, “Arthur”, likewise looking out for him. So, so sweet and I need more of it. 😀
Also, I LOVED KatherynefromPhilly’s musical arrangement. May have shed a tear myself and danced to it through my flat. 😊
4th October 2020 @ 7:25 pm
–Firstly, you said that Arthur might agree to go to the tavern with Merlin because it’s outside of Camelot borders but later he promises military support which, as we know from 1.10, Uther wouldn’t even give an entire village that was starved and threatened by bandits.–
fair! If I said outside of Camelot then I mispoke. In my head it’s just a tavern on the outskirts of Camelot. Like, really far away from the castle and the area where the knights regularly patrol and where the prince’s face is known. Kind of like Ealdor, which is still in Cendred kingdom, and Cendred would totally get pissed off, if someone tried to take it away from him, but he doesn’t actually care and probably isn’t really aware that it exists. And same for the people living in Ealdor and the king. Like, we know that Hunith went to try and speak to him and… he wouldn’t help? or wouldn’t even see her? Anyway, Hunith may know what Cendred looks like, but I doubt anyone else in the village does… and I’m kind of picturing this place as a similar tiny outlying village of Camelot. But yes, it’s still all a bit far fetched…
— If Arthur hasn’t killed them – why didn’t they re-join Dagr?–
I think between Arthur and Gwaine and their manly manly strength, and Merlin’s plate throwing, they’ve all been conviniently knocked uncincious. Every last one of them.
I mean, all around that’s the huge issue, isn’t it, as you say. It’s really lucky that Dagr is so hell bent taking his revenge on Arthur that he gets himself killed and therefore non of the nice town folk have to suffer anymore. It actually makes me think back to Will in Elador saying that Arthur has made everything worse and… well… he kind of had a point, didn’t he?
–Now, maybe I’ve just forgotten, but I cannot ever remember Arthur being vain.–
not as such i don’t think, no. Certainly not when he isn’t under a spell…. hmmm.
–Maybe these two, just like Lancelot, grew up training and hoping one day to be knights of Camelot only to be laughed at and turned away because they were a) not of noble birth and b) not pretty enough for the show’s coding of the good side–
what a way to travel just to justify the use of the word ‘rightful’ hahaha that’s what you call putting some elbow grease into your homework! lol and yes, oh my god sir oswalds haircut!!! I don’t know why we didn’t mention it, but omg it’s so bad!!!!!
–Even when Gwaine hits his head in the tavern and passes out, it feels really realistic and the sound design is, shall we say, very frank and honest?–
that also made me think of (and instantly wince!!) the moment where Gwaine (and possible Eoin??) hits his head on the back of Merlin’s bed… I flinch every time, because I can feel that pain! and Gwaine is drunk, so he can’t feel the pain, but possibly Eoin Macken did, and just did a fantastic job at rolling with the punches (or head bumps, as it were!)
–the fake knights play knife throwing when they could literally have dragged him before the king as soon as he was discovered in their rooms–
you’re obviously absolutely right, but I do wonder if there is some level of… excuse in the fact that they are not knights. they are evil evil bandits, and throwing daggers at someone in a cat and mouse game, before you kill him, is absolutely the same kind of fun as making merlin move the heavy trunk around the room for an hour, because it’s hilarious… I think they were absolutely building up to killing him, they just wanted to have some fun first. and then their fun was interrupted by Gwaine, and then the knights of camlot, which meant they had no choice but to go before the court and accuse Merlin “officially”, rather than just dealing with him.
–It feels a little patronising. It also feels a little demeaning for Colin Morgan. ☹–
I totally see that. though as I did not understand what the hell was going on, I agree that it was for audience benefit, I agree that it was patronising, I also agree that it must have been a sucky thing to get Morgan to do, because you messed it up in writing/filming/editing, but I did have NO CLUE what was going on, so the commentary was sort of necessary. But yes, mostly it was just a badly conceived battle scene. turns out Merlin was right! the meleee is just a whole bunch of blokes knocking the seven bells out of each other. and a mess to film / watch on top of that!
–I mean, it’s really sad actually to think that Arthur always assumes he never manages to deliver sufficient proof of his leadership abilities for his citizens.–
I think you can straight up blame Uther for that. Nothing is ever good enough, and ‘good enough’ only lasts until the next time there’s a chance to prove if, and if you don’t prove it, well, then you’re clearly not good enough…
–Finally, I do actually really like this episode even though I am not the greatest fan of Gwaine.–
I was going to say ‘don’t let people hear you say that!!’ but wow is it too late for that! haha
–it’s literally Arthur calling, “Merlin” to warn him and then Merlin calling, “Arthur”, likewise looking out for him. So, so sweet and I need more of it. 😀–
LOVE LOVE LOVE
7th October 2020 @ 2:57 pm
RE Sir Oswald’s haircut – I really hope that was a wig! For the actor’s sake, I really hope it was a wig! 🙂
RE Dagr’s men being conveniently knocked unconscious – very convenient indeed. But then, eventually, they’d wake up again, right? And then they’d rejoin Dagr (possibly to take their bloody revenge on the village because Arthur made everything worse, thank you, Prince William of Ealdor!) But they don’t. So, are they dead? Or too frightened to continue being evil? Maybe they’ve all dressed up as knights for the melee and the plot to kill Arthur was actually a lot thicker than we were ever shown. That would also explain why Dagr and Ebor were so sure of getting to the final stage to stab Arthur. They knew they had the backup that would get them there.
what a way to travel just to justify the use of the word ‘rightful’ hahaha that’s what you call putting some elbow grease into your homework! – I don’t find this sort of thing difficult at all (see point above). It’s more reigning in my imagination within the bounds of credibility and reason that’s the problem. 🙂
they are evil evil bandits, and throwing daggers at someone in a cat and mouse game, before you kill him, is absolutely the same kind of fun as making merlin move the heavy trunk around the room for an hour, because it’s hilarious – But then why didn’t they do the same with Arthur? No, with Arthur, they play by the knight’s rules (almost) making it just so much more complicated to exact their revenge.
they had no choice but to go before the court and accuse Merlin “officially”, rather than just dealing with him. – Did you mean Gwaine? Because that was what I meant: they never accuse Merlin even though they aboslutely could. Hence, Merlin MUST have a charmed life. 🙂
Also, thank you so, so much for taking so much time out of your free time on Sunday to reply to my comment. And all our comments and not just on Sunday. You guys are amazing! 🙂
7th October 2020 @ 9:34 pm
–or the actor’s sake, I really hope it was a wig! 🙂–
I’m 90% certain it’s either his own hair, or a wig. Like, I tried so hard to offer to dye my hair brown (it was bright red), to make life easier on the hair and make up people when I had to handle animals on screen, because I genuinly do not care what colour my hair is, and it changes every five days, anyway, and it would have made things so much easier for them, and they categorically would not let me. I guess it’s a sense of pride of being good at your job, and not needing anyone to go out of their way to change their own appearance, because that’s what they are paid for? I dunno. Anyway. I ended up with perfect make up, a £1k wig (more expensive than literally any one thing I have ever owned in my life), and you could not see a single strand of red hair…. so yeah, i really really hope that is a wig on him!!!
(also I am now too scared to image google the actor, just in case that is actually his hair and we’ve been very mean… =/)
–Maybe they’ve all dressed up as knights for the melee and the plot to kill Arthur was actually a lot thicker than we were ever shown. —
it was actually the biggest plot to overthrow camelot and no one realised just how big a deal it really was!!!! haha
–But then why didn’t they do the same with Arthur? No, with Arthur, they play by the knight’s rules (almost) making it just so much more complicated to exact their revenge.–
that’s the standard bully thing though, no? you always pick on the little guy (ie Merlin) because you know you can take him. when it comes to someone your own size, you don’t piss them off, or if you do, you do it with back up and a plan… hmmm.
— Did you mean Gwaine? Because that was what I meant: they never accuse Merlin even though they aboslutely could. Hence, Merlin MUST have a charmed life. 🙂–
yeah, sorry. gwaine. soup for brain is extra soup-y these days.
Xx
5th October 2020 @ 8:58 am
I agree with you about the Tavern scene- I don’t think Arthur came off well. The way he rode away all on his high horse was just too self-gratifying and bow-in-my-precence for me.
7th October 2020 @ 9:35 pm
I really think so much of it is the speed at which he rode away… which will be partially because he had lines to deliver, partially because they really didn’t like their actors doing anything more than walking lol but there is something particularly WTF about gwaine bleeding out on the horse, while arthur delivers his little speech… lol
4th October 2020 @ 7:03 am
I don’t think Merlin was just snooping with looking at the crystal the guy was wearing because Merlin was there to get the sword and they guy rolled on his back with the crystal on his chest and it glowed and did make a little “ magic sound” so when the guy rolled over Merlin looked at him and saw it and to Merlin it was obviously magic so he checked it out but yes Merlin is still a snoop . I also love how Arthur don’t love that the tavern girl called Merlin hands on and not him 😂 he was very offended
LESSONS
I think we as viewers learn that it’s not very hard to get into Merlins bed all you gotta do is be a handsome man and get a bit hurt while saving him 😂
And I definitely feel that the look of Gwaines face when Merlin first walks in is …. did I sleep with him? 😂 ( Queue the fan fictions )
I think something that Gwaine learned was that he shouldn’t be so quick to judge nobles because yes Uther was exactly what he’s said nobles where but Arthur wasn’t Arthur was good and fair and he wasn’t expecting that .
Also I have come to the conclusion that all guards in Camelot a deaf because Gaius and Merlin walk RIGHT in front of a guard and says something about the magic swords ….. honestly and they didn’t even really whisper .
4th October 2020 @ 1:00 pm
I think you’re probably right and that was absolutely the intention in regards to the crystal and the magic… I think the problem is that the show doesn’t differentiate very well, when it’s using something like a ‘magic sound’ to tell us the viewers that something magic is about to happen, when it’s using it to indicate that the characters on screen are picking up on something magic, or when it’s used to tell us that the magic sound actually is audible to all who are near by. Amd if Colin Morgan had played it slightly more like he was being enticed by the crystal, it would be obvious, but I assume he also didn’t know that there was going to be a magical crystal noise in that moment of the episode, so wasn’t able to play up to it. but yeah, I do think that’s probably what it was meant to be
M
4th October 2020 @ 4:14 pm
As to the guards: I think there are some cute and funny comics out there with a guard randomly hearing something weird about whatever-magic-is-happening-this-week-at-Camelot, or about Merlin having magic. I really need some kind of a spin-off series about the guards of Camelot basically knowing everything and taking bets on when Uther / Arthur realize what’s happening under their very noses! 😀
4th October 2020 @ 6:57 pm
I’d watch it!!!!
4th October 2020 @ 4:37 am
Thank you to everyone who left a nice little note about the piano composition. It was a joy to create. 🙂
4th October 2020 @ 1:00 pm
all the love is well deserved <3
9th October 2020 @ 10:36 pm
awwwwww. <3
Follow up note… I've found myself playing around with the composition even further whenever I'm in a chill mood. It's strangely… relaxing? By the time the podcast nears the show's final episode the piece will possibly have evolved into an Orchestral Symphony. I'll keep you posted.
5th October 2020 @ 10:07 pm
It was beautiful!!!✨✨✨
3rd October 2020 @ 9:47 pm
I’ve always noticed the parallels between this episode and the Lancelot episode, as you guys talked about, and I really like how that invites me to analyze and compare Lancelot and Gwaine more (both the episodes and the characters, and they’re individual relationships to Gwen, Merlin, and Arthur). (slightly ominous foreshadow music) I just wished the other future knights of the round table got this similar treatment, as I dont feel like all of there character introductions are as solid as these were
btw i absolutely love your podcast. i found it over the summer not long after i finished rewatching merlin (as many people are ive been rewatching old beloved tv shows in 2020) and am now really happy that im caught up and can contribute my own thoughts 😀 keep up the amazing work <3
4th October 2020 @ 12:44 pm
loving the slightly ominous foreshadowing music warning!! thank you 😀
And yes, urgh! we are going to have to say so many things about the rest of the knights and how they completely fail at giving them characters. I think it was on an episode of the Merlisten podcast, where they talked about how Percival was meant to have this whole backstory and… you know, an actual character, but then they decided to go with ‘he’s lancelot’s friend’ instead, and leave it at that. grrrr. sadly, in my opinion, even the knights with characters (lancelot and gwaine of course, but also Elyan for a bit there…) get less and less character as the show goes on, which is just a missed opportunity, sadly.
yay for re-discovering the bbc merlin love and great to have you along for the ride now you’re all caught up!
M Xx
3rd October 2020 @ 6:56 pm
Absolutely love this episode, such a cracker! Gwaine is such an interesting character – he appears pretty laid-back and not very serious on the surface but I think this is because he is hiding so much and not prepared to share his deeper emotions with just anybody. He has clearly experienced a fair amount of heartbreak and hurt in his life when he talks about his father and how his mother was left penniless. This has had a profound effect on him and is maybe why he lives his life on the road so that he can’t form attachments to people or places for fear that they will crumble down again.
The comedy in this episode is also so good! Love all the moments between Arthur and Merlin, especially in the tavern at the start. Colin’s facial expressions and his line of ‘I’d like to see you try’ just cracks me up and Bradley’s response when all the thugs walk in is just gold.
LESSONS LEARNED:
Gwaine learns that his view of nobles is not entirely correct because of how Arthur treats him and stands up for him. Whilst the actions of Uther still affirm Gwaine’s beliefs, I think he has learned to be less judgmental and not put all nobles in the same box. His own behaviour towards nobles is challenged because when he finds out who Arthur is, he immediately wishes he hadn’t helped him because he is going back to his fixed mindset that all nobles are self-centered and have little concern for commoners. However, I think that at the beginning of this episode, Gwaine is also guilty of this behaviour but as a mirror image. He very much lives for himself on the road and dislikes nobles, thinking they are all the same. Therefore he is sort of no better than them because he does not give them the chance to prove themselves different, in the same way that he believes nobles look down on commoners. As the episode progresses he realises that Arthur does not conform to his beliefs, leading him to show a bit of humility and admit he was wrong. He learns not to put people into stereotypes and to judge them by their actions. I think this is why his line of ‘nobility is defined by what you do, not by who you are’ in the council chambers is so good because, firstly, he is right to say it to Sir Oswald and Uther because their behaviour goes against the code they are trying to uphold, but also because it is something he has learned within himself.
I think Gwaine also learns that he can be likeable to other people and that many do and will care about him. The friendship he strikes up with Merlin proves this to him and he clearly feels comfortable around Merlin because of the way he opens up to him about his past and his father.
4th October 2020 @ 1:05 pm
–This has had a profound effect on him and is maybe why he lives his life on the road so that he can’t form attachments to people or places for fear that they will crumble down again.–
absolutely agree! he says he doesn’t stay anywhere long enough because people get fed up with him as a joke, but after everything that’s gone on in his life, ‘leave them, before they get the chance to leave you’ sounds much more like it… 🙁 🙁 🙁
–The comedy in this episode is also so good! —
this is genuinly my favourite type of bbc merlin comedy. and it only works in episodes where ultiamately the stakes aren’t very high and therefore you don’t actually ever worry. Like, you know from the outset in this episode that arthur is going to triumph, gwaine isn’t going to get killed, the evil guy will be punished, and all will be well. We spoke about it a little in the lancelot and gwen episode, where arthur and merlin are just a little bit quip-y and a bit punch drunk, especially considering the stakes, but it does mean that as a viewer I just really get on board with the fact that clearly, everything IS going to be fine, so I can just enjoy the ride until it is lol
M Xx
3rd October 2020 @ 3:00 pm
LESSONS!!
My dudes, we spend so much time talking about Gwaine’s effect on Merlin, but where is the analysis of Merlin’s effect on Gwaine?? Although we learn almost from the outset that Gwaine is an easy-going traveler/adventurer who stands up for random innocents and can easily make surface-level friendships at any tavern he steps into, we gradually learn that he probably (no, actually) has no real friends. His line ‘I never stay in one place for too long. People get sick of me.’ is such a sad, vulnerable confession, but delivered with Gwaine’s usual humour in a way that I never stopped to think about it until now. But Merlin’s immediate reply, ‘I didn’t,’ is so earnest and sweet that it makes my heart (and hopefully Gwaine’s heart) soar!! And then he tries so, so hard TWICE to convince Gwaine to stay, which I am CONVINCED no one has ever tried to do before, or at least has never garnered any hesitation, since Gwaine’s lifestyle suggests he is very used to cutting his losses and just moving on. BUT over the course of the episode, Merlin and Gwaine have formed a genuine bond, an intimate connection, and Merlin, through his actions and his compassion, has genuinely earned Gwaine’s loyalty and respect. He is the literal embodiment of Gwaine’s core belief: ‘actions over words and titles’. Gwaine has learned that there is potential for a true, deep friendship between him and Merlin. He has learned that people DO want him around, and not just because they value both his skills and opinions, but because they truly enjoy his company, because he ‘livens the place up’. So, of course, he hesitates.
And then I cry because Merlin and Gwaine are so chaotic soft. <3 I love them.
Also this is my first ever comment and I wanted to say I adore the podcast and listen to it while working out. Laughing and almost tripping on MY treadmill? It's more likely than you think!
3rd October 2020 @ 5:58 pm
Oh yes, there is definitely a sadness to the character of Gwaine. In my headcannon, he started pretending that he’s a commoner not only because of what happened to his father, but maybe also because he wanted to be appreciated for himself, not for his position… and it seems that until Merlin, he hasn’t been given this appreciation yet. It will be worth looking out for Gwaine’s sadness when he next appears!
And that’s why Gwaine and Merlin’s friendship is so precious and has so much potential: they both simultaneously realize that they like each other for just who they are, not for their special skills. This is an equal relationship. And I love them too. <3
3rd October 2020 @ 9:03 pm
Sorry to spam again, but now I’ve been thinking more about Gwaine and Merlin, and I believe the loneliness and sadness which you noticed about Gwaine applies to Merlin as well. Gwaine is like this one friend everybody has who’s the funniest and plays the role of a clown, but they might be actually masking some serious problems or depression. Gwaine totally does that, and so does Merlin, only in a different way, less “tavern troublemaker”, more “palace idiot”. I think they instantly sense that about each other, probably unconsciously!
4th October 2020 @ 6:50 pm
Actually, I’ve never noticed that before. But I think that’s absolutely true. Merlin feels drawn to Gwaine because they both play similar roles to shield themselves and make themselves less vulnerable.
SPOILERS AHEAD!
Your comment made me think about how many people have been hurt in the show by “nobility”. Not just by Uther and his war against sorcery. But simply by nobles taking it out on weaker people. Will springs to mind, Gwaine of course, later Elyan. Does anyone remember if this is ever picked up by the show/Arthur to show how he rights old wrongs? I mean, do we count the peasant knights as a conciliatory gesture here? I really can’t think of another example but if someone remembers an episode where a noble is clearly put in place to uphold justice for a wronged peasant (unrelated to magic), please let me know.
4th October 2020 @ 12:39 pm
please don’t die on treadmills because of us!!!!!
Mxx
5th October 2020 @ 10:16 pm
Wow! My heart! You’re definitely right about their dynamic. It makes me so soft.
3rd October 2020 @ 2:09 pm
LESSONS: We learn that nobility may give you power but not freedom. Even though the last bit is a light moment, there’s a sad undertone of Arthur envying the commoner’s life when he sees Gwen and Gwaine. His nobility might make him more powerful than someone like Gwaine, who he is literally looking down at, but he doesn’t have the freedom that Gwaine has in courting someone like Gwen.
Plus we learn that Arthur is a workaholic. Even when he states they’ve earned a drink, he adds that it is his way of checking up on his people. I.e. doing his princely duties. It’s nice that it ties back to Series 2 Episode 2 as he wants to step out of being a Prince and experience things unfiltered.
Other thoughts:
I love the way they’ve challenged the fairytale trope of ”no one is more handsome than The Prince”. And love Gwen’s ‘rejection’ of Gwaine. Also, does anyone else think she would have been a great Esmerelda in an adaptation of Hunchback of Notredame? Gwaine was onto something (and it’s not like I can’t think of someone eligible to play the knightly, blond Captain Phoebus!)
PS: Loved Katherine’s piece. It belongs in the official soundtrack 🙂
4th October 2020 @ 6:53 pm
Nobility gives you power but not freedom. Well, I think freedom here is relative. Like you also pointed out, Arthur has set his own standards for what he is free to do and what is his duty (even while in a tavern). As an individual noble, Arthur will deny himself more “freedoms” than, say, Uther because of his code of honour/knighthood that he sticks to.
SPOILERS AHEAD!
Uther, on the other hand, would not deny himself most things, especially because, as a noble, he has the power to do so. His reaction to finding Arthur and Gwen on 3.10 is very telling as Uther doesn’t think there was anything wrong with Arthur fooling around with her. His only limits are the preservation of his position of power so that he can further indulge in those other things. Hence, Arthur cannot marry Gwen as she would not be conducive to maintaining our increasing Camelot’s power. However, I don’t think Uther would object to Arthur having a mistress once he’s done his duty and married a princess/produced an heir.
Arthur thinks about this very differently because he not only looks down on Gwaine and Gwen on the scene. He has also willingly removed himself to a place of higher standards than the nobles around him/who follow his father.
With this in mind, it’s actually really telling that he keeps Merlin at his side, with him in his position of higher moral standards.
2nd October 2020 @ 9:41 pm
I have so much to say about Gwaine but it also relates a bit to his next episode, which I already can’t wait for. I find his way of life fascinating. He has clearly gotten in trouble several times, since he pretends to not be a noble but has still met several kings, you have to assume he had done something wrong. He’s good at getting out of trouble but he also seems to love getting into severe trouble. He purposefully puts himself in situations where there’s a good chance he’ll fail (and possibly die). The fight at the beginning, and the melee. The odds were against him. And he’ll keep doing it. When banished from Camelot, he decides to go somewhere that Merlin says is dangerous. He could go anywhere, but he keeps seeking out danger. What is he trying to compensate for? Or is he just reckless and has a dangerous disregard for his own life? Or is he possibly even suicidal at times?
And – spoiler alert – when he comes back later and Merlin tells him he can’t continue to live like this, he says “I know, but it’s fun trying”. Does he mean he knows he’s throwing away his life and he just doesn’t care? Because that’s really sad! Maybe he just needs a friend.
I also do love that he knows so much about magic. It’s hinted at several times, with the swords of course, but also because he has travelled everywhere, surely he has encountered magic, since it is only banned in Camelot. All the other countries have it! He may have even befriended sorcerers before. I’ll have a lot more to say about this next time! But he’s probably the character who knows the most about magic without actually practicing it. And his attitude towards magic is likely very fair and unbiased since he’s seen more of it so, as you said, he’s seen good and bad and he would know how magic itself isn’t good or bad, it all comes down to the sorcerer in question.
Also as far as the two baddies being able to completely destroy the Camelot knights, I think it does demonstrate how stupid the Knights’ Code is. Arthur has complained in the past about not being able to knight good fighters like Lancelot and Gwaine and he has also complained about the people he IS knighting, not being very good. Being born into a noble family doesn’t automatically make a man a good fighter and so he’s either going to have a tiny army or a huge army full of sucky knights. Honestly, apart from Leon, is any one of them even competent at all?
I forgot how good season 3 is. 🙂
4th October 2020 @ 1:22 pm
–“I know, but it’s fun trying”–
AHRHFUIGWHKRFHJ totally going to have to wait until we actually get to this point in the show but…. NNNNNGHHHH
also, it’s weird, and probably a huge problem with the show… but I don’t think we ever get clear information on whether other kingdoms have magic bans or not. Like, we learn about a multitude of kingdoms that allow or at least use magic. And I think we meet multiple kingdoms/kings that do not give us an opinion on magic… but yeah, it would make sense for it to literally be just Camelot, due to it being Uther’s vengence.
–he’s seen good and bad and he would know how magic itself isn’t good or bad, it all comes down to the sorcerer in question–
It’s weird, because Gwaine’s whole point is that because of his one experience with nobility (ie his father dying for their king and their king not caring about what happened to Gwaine and his mother) he has decided that ALL nobels suck. Which isn’t all that far from what uther has decided about magic, just without the hard core vengence combined with access to power…
it takes Merlin to make Gwaine realise, that maybe Arthur is okay. Not even to realise that some nobels are good, some nobels are bad, and you can’t tell by their title, but by their actions… literally just that maybe Arthur is the exception to the rule. And that when Arthur is king, things will be different. Which (apropos the above point) really only makes a difference, once Arthur does unite the lands of albion, does rule all of England in a just and fair way, and changes the rules for everybody, in his fair an awesome Arthur type way… but I digress.
I agree, in my head Gwaine absolutely does not judge magic and magic users by anything other than their actions. But it’s worth bearing in mind that the episode litereally tells us he only learns that because of Merlin… something to bear in mind, going forward.
–Honestly, apart from Leon, is any one of them even competent at all?–
considering Leon is the only one who lives time and time again. clearly, no, non of them are competent lol
5th October 2020 @ 11:09 pm
Because they never mention it, and the ban in Camelot is recent enough because of Uther, I always just assumed magic was allowed everywhere before that and is still probably allowed everywhere else. But yeah it’s never confirmed, is it?
Ok and you do have a point about Gwaine maybe seeing Arthur as an exception! I like to think he’d have learned a bigger lesson about nobles in general. But I don’t think it’s only because Merlin tells him so. We do see him act so surprised when Arthur speaks up for him, I think it’s partially what Merlin says and partially what Arthur proves himself. I don’t think he would have risked his life for Arthur, just because Merlin said he’s a good dude.
2nd October 2020 @ 9:28 pm
LESSONS
This is my first time submitting lessons and maybe I’ll get better at it but I really struggled with this one. Probably because it’s so similar to Lancelot, like you said. So Arthur would have learnt that nobility comes from the heart and commoners can prove their worth, but he already has! I think Gwaine is probably the one who learnt the most here. He thought of nobility as all being the same (btw I want to know how and why he has met so many kings because I had forgotten him saying that), and seemed really surprised by Arthur stepping up for him; perhaps Arthur is the only noble to ever show him kindness. Gwaine goes from hating nobles in general to saving one’s life. I think it’s a mirror lesson; common folk can be just as brave and noble of heart as any knight; and rich, privileged nobles can still be kind and fair people. Anyone can stand out from their peers.
Merlin learned to stop inviting his new friends to come hang out with Uther. He also learned that snooping is bad. (Oh no wait, this IS Merlin we’re talking about, he probably didn’t get that last bit.)
As someone with a medical background, I learned that apparently getting stabbed at an angle where it is impossible to hit the femoral artery would result in someone immediately passing out from loss of blood all the same. I’ll go to bed a lot brighter.
And last of all, the entire audience learned that Gwaine is THE BEST.
2nd October 2020 @ 7:13 pm
THIS IS WHY I LOVE MERLIN!!! These little interactions between Gwaine, Merlin, Gwen and Arthur just make my heart smile!
Gwaine’s charm and ability to see into people’s hearts is just so beautiful but his whole demenour- the pub-talk – makes him approachable and chilled out in the way that Lancelot wasn’t- no hate on Lancelot but there are so many interesting parallels.
and straight to LESSONS!
-From Merlin’s conversation he had with Gwaine about their fathers, I think Merlin learns or is at least reminded to be grateful for the time he was able to spend with Balinor. Gwaine’s comment that ‘At least you actually got to meet him’ can come across as diminishing Merlin’s struggles, but actually I think it’s good for Merlin to value that short time, because he got so much out of it both being proud of his magic, and of his father, and being able to connect with him. Breaks my heart just to think about ugh!
-I think Gwaine also helps Gwen to realise or remember something in their conversation about Arthur. Gwaine shows her that he can see her affection for Arthur, and through this she is reminded that her relationship with Arthur- even if it were just a crush- is never just about the two of them. There are always greater implications and it can’t be as private, personal and low-key as she might like.
I’m having so much fun being part of these discussions, it’s so lovely to be able to be -just a little- completely obsessed with Merlin and not ashamed, and talk to people who love it just as much, thank you all!
And to Catherine from Philly- your piano piece is just gorgeous! really really lovely and you played so beautifully.
4th October 2020 @ 1:25 pm
Absolutely no hate or disrespet to Lancelot at all, but I completely agree! Gwaine is just the best!!!!
Also…. I would just get to bored of lancelot in the long run… lol
M Xx
5th October 2020 @ 8:55 am
Yea… Gwaine is like spicy Lancelot!
2nd October 2020 @ 11:34 am
I absolutely loveee this episode! Gwaine is such a compelling character and so much fun. I love how he instantly forms distinct relationships with Merlin and Arthur (and *Michelle’s ominous spoiler music* will continue to build on those relationships in the future, and how they contrast with other relationships, such as Lancelot and Merlin’s). Also Ruth is right, his hair is just so pretty.
Other highlights was the fun pushing at the end of the episode – just genuine affection and fun between Merlin and Arthur is so nice and increasingly rare to see – and Arthur talking to Uther about the idea of nobility, and how it extends beyond birth and into character and how one conduct’s themselves and treats those around them.
I also think we do some interesting things with ostracism in this episode. Merlin is ostracised from others because of circumstances of his birth – his magic and destiny – something he cannot change about himself, but is constantly constrained, socially limited and endangered by. Gwaine is an interesting foil to this, because he is voluntarily ostracised from greater recognition by the circumstances of his birth – of nobility. He chooses not to have this recognised and so has a difficult and unstable life as a result, whereas Merlin has no choice in this. I’m not sure I have a lot to say about it at this point, but is an interesting juxtaposed position to have them begin their interactions at.
LESSONS LEARNED
I think as far as Arthur is concerned, we have seen him come up against decisions and traditions Uther has implemented in the past and how they can be unjust and discriminative. Arthur has started to engage with these ideas, but has clearly not actually *learned* them yet, as they continue to be plot-relevant struggles. This episode continues to push those ideas for Arthur. As is often the case, we can appreciate some kind of rule or limitation is unfounded when we see it happening to other people, but experiencing it personally does bring it to a new kind of reality, and can be the push needed to actually act on it (especially when we come from a place of privilege). The final scene affirms that further – Arthur textualises the rules that prevent non-nobles form becoming nights (which we have previously come up against with Lancelot), and Merlin textualises the rules that prevent Arthur and Gwen’s relationship from coming to fruition (again, we have come up against this previously).
Hopefully having these discriminatory rules with questionable basis behind them compounding will be the push that Arthur needs to not only realise that they need to change, but that it really is in his hands to bring that change about, and it is not only his job as a prince (and one day king) to use his influence and experiences in a way that both keeps Camelot stable, and changes as it benefits his people.
1st October 2020 @ 11:36 pm
I love Gwaine. I love him so much. His entire character makes me very happy, which I needed tonight (moving to uni the day after tomorrow is Scary). I love his recklessness and how he respects Merlin and how his protectiveness doesn’t turn into being patronising, and I love how he doesn’t care about speaking his mind to Uther. And his hair which is far too nice for a time before hair conditioner.
Merlin’s feelings about melees are basically my feelings about sport.
Once again, Arthur being aggressive towards Merlin for humour bothers me. Like you said, a metal helmet is totally different from a pillow. There’s a huge difference between the kind of shoving we get at the end (which I like!) and the actual violence in this scene.
I assume the “killing Arthur will secretly sharp swords” thing was supposed to work because you couldn’t prove that you knew you’d picked up your sharp sword rather than your blunt sword? Like “oh my god, I SWEAR I had my blunt sword! Did my squire give me the wrong one?!” or whatever. Of course that only works if the king is like… unusually forgiving. And Uther is not the most forgiving man. So, even if everyone believes it was an accident, they’d still be executed.
Mirroring Merlin and Gwaine is super interesting, and I don’t know precisely what my interpretation of it is. Something about their positions in relation to Camelot, to Uther, etc, not fitting into the social order neatly and not obeying perceived “natural” hierarchies.
I was confused when Arthur informed the villagers who he was, because there’s no reason for the villagers to believe him without some form of proof. They had previously not recognised him at all, so they have presumably not seen portraits of him, so would they have believed some other posh-accented dude who said “oh btw I’m a prince”??
When Merlin said “I’ll pay” and Arthur said “you will,” I was really worried for a second that Arthur was going to literally make Merlin pay for Gwaine’s drinks, which would be insensitive even for Arthur — but cleaning boots is dull but harmless. Bankrupting Merlin for someone else’s mistakes would have been a massive slug move. Progress on Arthur’s part from his lack of awareness back when he stayed with Gwen in season 1?
Merlin not telling Arthur about the blades just feels like yet another of those “why didn’t he just try” situations — couldn’t they have him try and then get interrupted, or have Arthur not believe him at all, or something, just to show us that Merlin DOES have to deal with it alone? Like when there’s enemies that can’t be killed with magic and Merlin doesn’t even TRY?
I’m almost glad you also found the melee scene confusing, because I thought I was confused because I was playing tetris at the same time but now I don’t have to feel bad for not paying full attention.
2nd October 2020 @ 12:38 am
Good luck with moving to uni! 🙂
Oh yes, I forgot to mention in my original comment how much I hated Arthur throwing a friggin’ piece of armor at Merlin. I think I hate it almost as much as Arthur mounting a horse from Merlin’s back in 2.01. It’s especially unfortunate in an episode where Merlin is supposed to realize that there is a difference between Arthur’s friendly banter and the “knights” who treat him like dirt. As far as my list of frustration for the series goes, I can’t decide which one is worse: Morgana’s poor development or these occasional cruelties. This was also the one reason why, on my first watch of “Merlin”, I didn’t ship Merthur that much throughout seasons 2 and 3, just because it was so difficult to forget those awful scenes, whereas, sadly, the beautiful moments somehow got lost more easily. Now, I just treat them as a horrible mistake and pretend they don’t exist. And ship Merthur. In whatever form, universe or era. Because who’s gonna stop me? 😛
4th October 2020 @ 6:24 pm
|How did the move go?? Hope you’re halfway settled and have unpacked at least the most important boxes and you’ve got all your favourite things to hand!!
–Merlin’s feelings about melees are basically my feelings about sport.–
lol you and Ruth both!!
–There’s a huge difference between the kind of shoving we get at the end (which I like!) and the actual violence in this scene–
having those two moment in the same episode, and them being played similarly in tone and definitely the same as far as impact on the relationship between arthur and merlin goes, really goes to show that the show does not seem to understand just how horrible the first one is, and just how abused merlin should feel. I mean, it is so no wonder that when the show was live there were just thousands of hurt-comfort fics, literally all based around merlin either passing out from exhaustion, and arthur realising just how much is being asked of merlin and just how horrible he’s been, or gwain, gwen, morgana, another knight (choose your flavour!) stepping in and taking care of merlin, after arthur was horrible to him. the entire show drops hundred of flufftober prompts every week.
–And Uther is not the most forgiving man. So, even if everyone believes it was an accident, they’d still be executed.–
you’re right, and literally none of our villains ever seem to think that far… or be quite that… willing to die for their revenge. like, if you think that arthur must be done away with, and you are willing to sacrifice your own life to make it happen, sure, go for it! but as you say, there is no way, however much of an accident it is or you manage to make it look like, that uther isn’t just going to turn around and have their heads chopped off!
— Bankrupting Merlin for someone else’s mistakes would have been a massive slug move. Progress on Arthur’s part from his lack of awareness back when he stayed with Gwen in season 1?–
we unfortuately obviously never talk about money, wages, days off or anything of the like… (another thing beloved in fanfic lol) but yeah, i do think you can read some growth and situational awareness into this from arthur’s point of view. though you can also just read that he isn’t going to in any way miss the money, and that he thinks it’s a lot funnier to make merlin and gwaine clean muddy boots. but I prefer the first one!
–Merlin not telling Arthur about the blades just feels like yet another of those “why didn’t he just try” situations — couldn’t they have him try and then get interrupted–
they should do that more often! like, it totally worked in regards to merlin really needing to tell arthur something about the siege and morgana’s part in it, in the opening double episode, except arthur was too busy and (thought he) already knew, so he wouldn’t listen to merlin…. of course in that scene there is the issue with merlin not talking to arthur until they’re literally walking into the throne room, which is silly, but the interruption really works, and yes, I would so prefere having an insane interrupting cow every other week, to explain why merlin doesn’t just tell arthur stuff, than what we get, where merlin just doesn’t tell arthur stuff =/
–I’m almost glad you also found the melee scene confusing, because I thought I was confused because I was playing tetris at the same time but now I don’t have to feel bad for not paying full attention.–
hahahaha i mean I am sure Tetris did not help but nope, that melee makes no sense. You know the diamonds that float above SIMS characters heads? I need one of those in different colours for each knight in the melee, and honestly, even then I’m not sure I’d get it =?
M Xx
6th October 2020 @ 5:12 pm
“|How did the move go?? Hope you’re halfway settled and have unpacked at least the most important boxes and you’ve got all your favourite things to hand!!”
Well, it was super stressful at first but I auditioned for the college chapel choir today and got in, so tbh I feel like that’s a good sign and things will be ok!
“I mean, it is so no wonder that when the show was live there were just thousands of hurt-comfort fics,”
Exactly!!!
“You know the diamonds that float above SIMS characters heads? I need one of those in different colours for each knight in the melee, and honestly, even then I’m not sure I’d get it ”
Same! Another way in which melees are like sport… I have no idea who is who or what’s going on!
6th October 2020 @ 7:04 pm
that’s so awesome about choir! go you!!
–Same! Another way in which melees are like sport… I have no idea who is who or what’s going on!–
hahaha this is why i really only like sport if the teams are wearing SUPER DISTINCT kits and therefore I at all times know at least who’s with which side… and whenever I watch football, I have to make a mental note at the start of the goalie’s kit, because those sods always have to wear a differnently colour shirt from the rest of the team, to make my life harder!!! lol
4th October 2020 @ 6:54 pm
oh my god, I SWEAR I had my blunt sword! Did my squire give me the wrong one?! –
I wish, I so wish they’d put that in the show. 😂
1st October 2020 @ 10:31 pm
Wow thank you so much for the point for the Tears of UP episode, I was not expecting that at all!
LESSONS
I found it very difficult this week, but I thought I would go for Merlin again (yikes will I butcher this!). I don’t stop going on about this and hope it doesn’t get boring but I think once again Merlin could be learning that his life is for Arthur, not for him. Although, like you said, Gwaine allows Merlin a friendship that seems to be nothing to do with Arthur, it actually turns out to be for Arthur’s benefit. Merlin’s relationships with others often aid Arthur: it was for Merlin that both Arthur and Gwen went to Ealdor with the shared intentiuon of helping a friend, to have that first interaction and end up as Arthur’s romantic interest and *Michelle’s ominous spoiler music* supportive future loving wife. Merlin’s introduction of Gwaine and Lancelot to Arthur resulted in them both becoming part of Arthur’s core team of protectors. I think in some ways, all three of these close friends of Merlin exist in the narrative to keep Arthur physically and emotionally safe and well (to an extent!). Merlin even says to Gwaine “You and Arthur fought well together” (though not so much practically) so despite Gwaines loyalty to Merlin as a friend, in the grand scheme of things, once again, Merlin’s own life has been used to benefit Arthur’s even if Merlin doesn’t know it. That was awfully articulated, I am so sorry – hopefully you get the idea!
I do really love Danuta’s idea of Merlin learning to appreciate his worth outside of the Destiny, however, and just having those friendships that he doesn’t believe are anything to do with helping Arthur and his Destiny. Perhaps it is even more tragic that way, because he doesn’t even realise just how much he is a pawn in this bigger picture, how much he has been used. We often talk about how much Morgana is used by those around her, but perhaps Merlin is just as much? *cough cough Dragon*
I would really like to quickly say how absolutely incredible Katheryne’s piano piece was, I listened to it about five million times and sobbed through every single one for the pure beauty of it. Thank you so much Katheryne for blessing our ears, you are amazing.
Sorry this is so long! You guys were incredible as per usual and thank you for all your hard work!
4th October 2020 @ 6:36 pm
we are so happy with all the love Kathryne is getting for the stunning stunning piece of music!!! that makes us so happy <3 <3
Alsoi, sadistically glad we're not the only ones who were crying about it a lot!!!!
1st October 2020 @ 6:19 pm
LESSONS
Gwaine learned that not every nobleman/king is bad. It sounds straightforward, but it’s more complex than it seems. Gwaine used to say a maxim “it’s what’s inside that matters”, but it was just an excuse for being prejudiced against nobles. Now, he ACTUALLY follows the maxim.
Arthur learned (again) that maybe the rules, codes and social divides should be taken with a grain of salt, and that maybe changing the rules one day isn’t as unthinkable as it seems.
Merlin learned that he could be appreciated just for himself and have a life, purpose and friendship outside of the whole destiny stuff. Taken that his self-esteem has been successfully undermined or used as a tool by the figures of authority in his life (mainly Gaius, Uther and the dragon), he definitely needs more Gwaine in his life to remind him of that! Basically to get the message “you are good enough because you’re funny, compassionate, quirky and lovely, not because an ancient prophecy speaks of your superpowers”.
2nd October 2020 @ 7:22 pm
with the Arthur lesson, I think you’re right that we’ve had it before, but the difference is that it becomes more obscure each time? At the beginning, the idea of having to be noble to become a knight was pulled into question; which is already quite full-on and serious anyway. Now however, it’s about the melee which can be seen as stupid and ridiculous (by Merlin at least), but even this “harmless” game had greater implications for inequality and true nobility, and although these things have been part of Arthur’s life for a long time, he needs to pull even this into question.
1st October 2020 @ 6:08 pm
OMG, I LOVE GWAINE. ❤
Now, to something more coherent.
I love how this episode makes parallels with the Lancelot episode. They establish Gwaine and Lancelot as complete opposites:
Lancelot is: a commoner who pretends to be a knight; a saint who only makes a mistake once; a hero who’s willing to sacrifice his life in a heroic fight with a monster; man who loves Gwen so perfectly and selflessly that it’s almost selfish (when he doesn’t allow her to choose between him and Arthur).
Gwaine is: a nobleman who pretends to be a commoner; a troublemaker with a redeeming quality (loyalty/nobleness of heart); a guy who’s willing to sacrifice his life in an un-heroic tavern brawl; a man who flirts with Gwen kinda selfishly, but soon realizes that he’s not wanted and selflessly leaves.
It’s almost as if Gwaine was Lancelot’s parody… and yet…
And yet, because the episodes in which Gwaine and Lancelot appear are constructed so similarly, we immediately see the similarities between the characters: their loyalty, nobleness, the way they care for Merlin, the way they want to serve Arthur, their willingness to sacrifice their lives. It’s very neat and good! 🙂
I love Merlin and Gwaine’s relationship. As you said, it’s good that Gwaine doesn’t get to know about Merlin’s magic and appreciates him just for his personality. This relationship is also a nice parallel to Arthur and Merlin’s relationship in a way Lancelot’s friendship wasn’t: it’s full of banter and fun, but we get to see how beautifully Merlin opens up when he’s around someone who doesn’t hide his feelings as much as Arthur does. It’s just lovely how happy Merlin is! My heart melts when I see my puppy happy ❤
And the last shoving scene between Merlin and Arthur is just the best. I think that Merlin’s playfulness towards Arthur here is enhanced by the time he spent with Gwaine.
I really actually look forward to the next episode! The last week’s discussion and especially Esmé’s thoughts on destiny got me thinking and BOY, DO I HAVE THINGS TO SAY.
4th October 2020 @ 6:48 pm
loving the comparison between lancelot and gwaine, especially around how they interact with gwen!! there is something kind of awesome about our very limited cast of characters, and their very limited character development – that we often complain about, and I think rightly so, but!… it does mean that you have all the characters interact with each other (for lack of choice really) and there’s only very few combinations you don’t get very often (Merlin and Uther for example), which means it does allow for these very direct parallel analysis of your characters, which is fascinating!
–we get to see how beautifully Merlin opens up when he’s around someone who doesn’t hide his feelings as much as Arthur does–
🙁 🙁 🙁 oh Arthur, you tiny blond broken biscuit… 🙁 🙁 🙁
and yes, happy Merlin is the best Merlin!! (possibly because we really don’t see it very often. WOE.)
— I think that Merlin’s playfulness towards Arthur here is enhanced by the time he spent with Gwaine.–
I like that! And I totally feel that. Depending which of your friends you spend a lot of time with, you kind of take on their manerism, and then when you find yourself with different people apruptly, you haven’t quite shaken it off yet I guess? this I am sure is hugely to do with being foreign for myself, but I’ve certainly found myself not quite switching gears quick enough, when going from mate-y banter, to speaking to proper grown ups, or from dealing with young people at work and the ‘educational, yet stern’ way of speaking to them that was often necessary, to talking to my best beloved, when they’ve fucked something up, and using that same tone of ‘I’m not angry, I’m just disappointed’ haha Oops?
1st October 2020 @ 11:29 am
Uhhh I guess a lesson that Arthur learned is, indeed, it’s what’s on the inside that counts. I think he already knew this, based on with his interactions with Gwen and Merlin and Lancelot, and that Gwaine serves as a reminder, but it’ll be interesting to see how this affects his use of his power later on, and how this sets him apart from Uther as king/regent, and whether thus makes him a better ruler than his father.
1st October 2020 @ 11:23 am
Alright, so this might just be me bulling my way through an English assignment, but there’s one line of Arthur’s that really stands out to me, and that I think is actually quite clever. When he and Merlin are discussing the meleé for the first time, Arthur says that it’s the ‘ultimate test of strength and courage.’ Later on, you have Gwaine and Arthur, who later on in the season get called this, facing off together. I’m not sure if it’s foreshadowing or not *insert Michelle’s spoiler music*, but if it is, it’s very well done.
I’m a but confused as to why Uther still banishes Gwaine in the end, even though… he didn’t attack…. knights, and the only way I’ve been able to justify this to myself is that even though Ethan and Oswald weren’t the real deal, everyone THOUGHT they were, which kinda maybe shows Gwaine’s a bit of a wild card with little respect for authority, and that he had the CAPACITY to attack knights and other such noblemen. (Sorry of that doesn’t make much sense.) I remember absolutely nothing about next week’s episode, but I have the vague feeling that I don’t like it.
1st October 2020 @ 10:35 pm
Regarding Uther banishing Gwaine even though he didn’t attack knights, I do wonder if it’s because of Uther’s stubbornness (as Arthur mentions at the end that he’s a stubborn man) — he can’t bear to be seen to have made a mistake, so he insists on punishing Gwaine for, I guess, being disrespectful and violating the terms of his previous exile. That is, he can’t say “I was wrong to exile you,” but he can say “I exiled you and then you came back, so now you’re double exiled.”
2nd October 2020 @ 11:38 am
I thought the same thing re the ‘strength and courage’ comment!! Had never caught that on a rewatch before, but it’s so cool that the first episode Arthur and Gwaine appear in together they succeed together in this ‘ultimate test’ and then later are shown working together with the same skills being utilised in their team work. I did check and both the episodes were written by Julian Jones so I like to think that was an intentional nugget on his part
4th October 2020 @ 6:55 pm
ooooh, nice additional fact!! I’m happy to accept this as fact from now on! haha
4th October 2020 @ 6:54 pm
oooooh.. I liek the strength and courage connection!!!! can’t really discuss it on the podcast, but yes! I like it!!!
–I’m a but confused as to why Uther still banishes Gwaine in the end, even though…–
I think definitely what you’re saying about Gwaine being a wild card, and also what Esme says below about stubbornness. I think in addition, the body swap and attack on Arthur’s life, and how easy it would have been to kill him (in this episode, because character consistency is for losers) if it wasn’t for Gwain… all that is probably not something that Uther wants to advertise exactly. So while he should be rewarding Gwaine for catching out the bandits using magic and killing them and saving Arthur…. he can’t really, without letting the kingdom know that that’s what happened. But also, Gwaine didn’t kill them because they were bandits. Gwaine didn’t know they were bandits. Gwaine killed them, because they were going to kill Arthur, but with the full (incorrect) knowledge that they were knights, so yeah, I think right back to what you said about him being a wild card.
1st October 2020 @ 8:28 am
Yes! I was waiting for the Gwaine episode!
4th October 2020 @ 6:55 pm
quite right, too!